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Post by tiger40 on Jan 19, 2021 14:01:53 GMT -5
Another problem with Standing On The Shoulder Of Giants was that both Bonehead and Guigsy had left the band so at that point they were recording the album as a three piece with guests making an appearance on some tracks. However, it's still better than it's presser Be Here Now.
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Post by My Big Name on Jan 19, 2021 17:53:46 GMT -5
Another problem with Standing On The Shoulder Of Giants was that both Bonehead and Guigsy had left the band so at that point they were recording the album as a three piece with guests making an appearance on some tracks. However, it's still better than it's presser Be Here Now. I thought Noel recorded all the parts that would've been Guigsy/Bonehead's? |
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Post by tiger40 on Jan 19, 2021 18:35:09 GMT -5
Another problem with Standing On The Shoulder Of Giants was that both Bonehead and Guigsy had left the band so at that point they were recording the album as a three piece with guests making an appearance on some tracks. However, it's still better than it's presser Be Here Now. I thought Noel recorded all the parts that would've been Guigsy/Bonehead's? He did I think but with Bonehead and Guigsy leaving like that i don't think that it helped the mood in the band. I seem to remember that Noel said something about it in an interview once. I can't remember all of it now but i do remember him mentioning it. |
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Post by My Big Name on Jan 19, 2021 19:51:46 GMT -5
I thought Noel recorded all the parts that would've been Guigsy/Bonehead's? He did I think but with Bonehead and Guigsy leaving like that i don't think that it helped the mood in the band. I seem to remember that Noel said something about it in an interview once. I can't remember all of it now but i do remember him mentioning it. Oh yeah it definitely took a lot of the soul out of the band but I think when it came down to recording it wouldn't have really changed much. I'm pretty sure Noel recorded bass on DM anyway so Guigsy wouldn't have been missed at all during the SOTSOG sessions. |
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Post by tiger40 on Jan 20, 2021 13:56:29 GMT -5
He did I think but with Bonehead and Guigsy leaving like that i don't think that it helped the mood in the band. I seem to remember that Noel said something about it in an interview once. I can't remember all of it now but i do remember him mentioning it. Oh yeah it definitely took a lot of the soul out of the band but I think when it came down to recording it wouldn't have really changed much. I'm pretty sure Noel recorded bass on DM anyway so Guigsy wouldn't have been missed at all during the SOTSOG sessions. True that Noel recorded bass on Definitely Maybe so Guigsy wouldn't have been missed during the Standing On The Shoulder Of Giants sessions and he was never a great bass player anyway. However, it's a shame that Noel himself wasn't really feeling the songs as it could have been a better album than what it is. |
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Post by The Crimson Rambler on Jan 21, 2021 12:04:57 GMT -5
I like the album, but like all of the albums post-BHN it's got obvious problems. But it is the best Noughties Oasis album. (I'd say DOYS has the best highs though or best run on any 2000s album) I've actually got a soft spot for both ICSAL and PYMWYMI, if they both come on my shuffle I always enjoy them. But they of course aren't great and have obvious problems. I can't stand Little James and Sunday Morning Call. Staggering SMC was released as a single, no wonder the public didn't resonate with the album lol with rubbish like that being released. If it wasn't for Let There Be Love it'd be comfortably the worst Oasis single of all time. Who Feels Love? is alright but I wouldn't say i love it. But I like the fact it's something different, same with FITB. I adore GP, GLIO, RIO and WDIAGW. In hindsight, the album is seen of as much better of course with how bleh HC and DBTT were. And the problems DOYS had in it's 2nd half. Put Yer Money isn't that bad, it's much better than I Can See A Liar personally. Of all the mental decisions Noel has taken over the years though, not placing Let's All Make Believe on the album is beyond me. You could understand it with the likes of The Masterplan because the times were overflowing with great tunes. But how Noel thought a lot of the far far inferior songs on Giants were superior is almost anxiety inducing. Thought you might like this quote I just stumbled across: Oh and you might like to know that The Masterplan was written after the Morning Glory? sessions. No excuse not to hold it over mind... |
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Post by defmaybe00 on Jan 21, 2021 13:32:26 GMT -5
Another problem with Standing On The Shoulder Of Giants was that both Bonehead and Guigsy had left the band so at that point they were recording the album as a three piece with guests making an appearance on some tracks. However, it's still better than it's presser Be Here Now. While I agree that it's one of the things that affected the mood of the band themselves and the perception around them, from a pure musical standpoint I think Noel and Paul Stacey did a lovely job, bar maybe Sunday Morning Call's guitar solo The bass playing on SOTSOG is refreshing to hear The decision making and maybe the lack of a potential big hit single bring the album down, but the good things about it are really good Noel may think it was a failure because his state of mind wasn't so great, but I'm glad Oasis gave us something so gloomy and a bit more spaced in terms of sound, even if it happened as a negative reaction to events I still rate it highly and it makes for a nice change of pace and direction Could it have been better? Yes, clearly, and sometimes I wonder about what could've happened if it was 2015 onwards Noel Gallagher (in terms of approach and ambitions) working on it instead, but I'm genuinely glad it happened and I enjoy it a lot |
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Post by tiger40 on Jan 21, 2021 14:06:00 GMT -5
Another problem with Standing On The Shoulder Of Giants was that both Bonehead and Guigsy had left the band so at that point they were recording the album as a three piece with guests making an appearance on some tracks. However, it's still better than it's presser Be Here Now. While I agree that it's one of the things that affected the mood of the band themselves and the perception around them, from a pure musical standpoint I think Noel and Paul Stacey did a lovely job, bar maybe Sunday Morning Call's guitar solo The bass playing on SOTSOG is refreshing to hear The decision making and maybe the lack of a potential big hit single bring the album down, but the good things about it are really good Noel may think it was a failure because his state of mind wasn't so great, but I'm glad Oasis gave us something so gloomy and a bit more spaced in terms of sound, even if it happened as a negative reaction to events I still rate it highly and it makes for a nice change of pace and direction Could it have been better? Yes, clearly, and sometimes I wonder about what could've happened if it was 2015 onwards Noel Gallagher (in terms of approach and ambitions) working on it instead, but I'm genuinely glad it happened and I enjoy it a lot Oh, I don't think that Noel and Paul Stacey did a bad job with the album but it's a shame that most of the songs weren't a bit better. And, it's a shame that Noel wasn't in the best state of mind at the time as I'm sure if Noel's mind was in better shape then I'm sure that the album could have been a bit better than what we got. |
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Post by Parka Flames on Jan 21, 2021 15:25:34 GMT -5
Put Yer Money isn't that bad, it's much better than I Can See A Liar personally. Of all the mental decisions Noel has taken over the years though, not placing Let's All Make Believe on the album is beyond me. You could understand it with the likes of The Masterplan because the times were overflowing with great tunes. But how Noel thought a lot of the far far inferior songs on Giants were superior is almost anxiety inducing. Thought you might like this quote I just stumbled across: Oh and you might like to know that The Masterplan was written after the Morning Glory? sessions. No excuse not to hold it over mind... Let's All Make Believe as the album opener? That would have been interesting, definitely would have set up SOTSOG as a far more mellow affair than anything that had come before |
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Post by tiger40 on Jan 21, 2021 16:19:30 GMT -5
I didn't know that Let's All Make Believe was going to be the opening track on Standing On The Shoulder Of Giants. Would it have been a better opening track than Fucking In The Bushes though? Maybe not but who knows if it would have worked as an album opener.
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Post by andymorris on Jan 22, 2021 12:56:46 GMT -5
Would it have been a better opening track than Fucking In The Bushes though? The answer is no. That song was / is the perfect album opener. Hell i would put it as an opener on every album ever released. By every artist. |
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Post by matt on Jan 22, 2021 13:52:34 GMT -5
So it seems like I Can See A Liar replaced Let's All Make Believe? Where would it fit on everyone's tracklisting?
I think one of the biggest misfires conceptually is not making the album more explicitly introspective, which is why it's a crime (no pun intended) Let's All Make Believe didn't make it. It should have been Oasis 'loner' album. Solitude is often a recurring theme in Oasis songs and even underneath all the euphoric bluster of their hit singles (which misleads the casual listener into not noticing the nuances), it was one of their key defining traits. You only become really conscious to it as its more explicit in their b-sides. In fact, the ability of Noel as a songwriter to embellish so many of his songs with the idea of solitude with positive self-assurance without being miserabilist and depressing is a unique trait of Oasis that their detractors completely miss out.
It's not a contrived emotion from Noel, you don't ever get feelings of insincerity from an Oasis song so it would have been cool to bring this to the forefront of the songs. There's a good number of them on the album - some work better than others (the weaker ones, like Sunday Morning Call, could have been worked on a bit more) but that vibe is torpedoed by less thoughtful tunes. Fuckin In The Bushes and Go Let It Out are the two standout songs that don't adhere to this theme, but they can be forgiven for staying on the tracklist, because they're two very good tunes and can provide lighter relief from making it too heavy.
But I do feel it's a missed opportunity not to hone in on the more downbeat aspect of it and make an entire album of it. As such, you can only probably make a decent EP out of the kind of songs I'm talking about.
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Post by World71R on Jan 22, 2021 15:58:57 GMT -5
Thinking about Let's All Make Believe as the opener, I'd have:
Let's All Make Believe
Gas Panic!
Where Did it All Go Wrong?
Sunday Morning Call
Fuckin' in the Bushes
Go Let it Out
Who Feels Love?
Put Yer Money Where Yer Mouth Is
One Way Road
Roll it Over
A total inverse of what we got with the actual album but I like it. It's moody and to the point right away, really showing Noel's more self-aware side, but then it picks up toward the end. I think I like that.
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Post by matt on Jan 22, 2021 16:10:22 GMT -5
Forgot about One Way Road. That would fit well with the album, although work would need to be done on the arrangement to make it less plodding (Paul Weller's arrangement for his cover of it is great, although wouldn't fit the vibe of the album).
I'm thinking more trip hop beats, with Liam on vocal.
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Post by The Crimson Rambler on Jan 22, 2021 16:28:54 GMT -5
Weller's cover of One Way Road would be my vote for the best cover of an Oasis song there's been. Not that I've heard many good ones unfortunately. I didn't really appreciate the original until I heard Weller's cover and that in turn changed how I listened to the song. Good stuff.
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Post by defmaybe00 on Jan 22, 2021 16:30:06 GMT -5
I love One Way Road how it is tbh, lowkey one of my favourite Oasis songs
That and Let's All Make Believe definitely should've been on the album
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2021 16:30:57 GMT -5
Never rated one way road
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Post by World71R on Jan 22, 2021 17:20:04 GMT -5
One Way Road is a nice slow burn of a song. If Sunday Morning Call is someone waking up the morning after a wild bender of a three-day party with an awful hangover, then One Way Road is that person waking up Monday morning realizing they have to do something different than what they've been doing and putting that in motion. I wish the second verse was different, but it flows well, and I like how the second run through the chorus goes right into the outro solo.
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Post by tiger40 on Jan 22, 2021 17:49:23 GMT -5
One Way Road is great and along with Let's All Make Believe they're my two favourite Oasis b.sides from the Standing On The Shoulder Of Giants era.
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Post by underneaththesky on Jan 23, 2021 1:23:43 GMT -5
1.Let's All Make Believe
2.Go Let It Out
3.Who Feels Love?
4.Put Yer Money Where Yer Mouth Is
5.Little James
6.Fuckin' In The Bushes
7.Gas Panic!
8.Where Did It All Go Wrong?
9.I Can See A Liar
10.Roll It Over
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Post by matt on Jan 25, 2021 13:14:02 GMT -5
In all the time I've been an Oasis fan, I've always thought Roll It Over is a good song. But never have I gone through a phase where it is my favourite for a certain time. Until now that is (maybe it's something to do with the fact I'm now 30!).
It's so brilliantly melancholy. I know we often criticise Oasis (or Noel) for making songs too plodding (e.g. criminally making Let There Be Love so snooze inducing), but the slower pace of this just suits the vibe perfectly. It's world weary but still defiant.
But yet again, Liam's vocals are just epic. The demo doesn't much interest me, Noel's vocals just don't pull you in as to the potential of the song, but Liam delivers it and then some. The production, like a lot of the album, is flawless. Multilayered and sonically interesting - nice guitar riff, big reverb on the laid back drumming style of Alan White (a huuuuge part in making Oasis songs sound sophisticated), gospel choir for the final chorus and I love that drone effect you hear in the fade out (is it a distorted guitar effect?). Interestingly, the credits state 'sonic guidance by Mark Coyle'. I believe this was the last album he worked on with Oasis? We all know the false starts in him trying to initially produce Definitely Maybe but if he did indeed have influence on the sound of Oasis albums, then you can't fault his efforts. I don't have any major issues with the sound of any of the first four Oasis albums (I can even forgive Be Here Now for its overproduction). Just when you thought they were going to evolve, they then went on to make their most musically timid albums in HC, DBTT and DOYS. Coincided with Mark Coyle ending his association with the band maybe (unless he worked on subsequent ones of which I'm unaware of)?
I've had the song on repeat for a few days now. Definitely in the top 5 Oasis songs from 2000 onwards. For the heights it reaches, Giants is definitely the fourth best Oasis album, and far better than any of the half-baked dross albums that followed.
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Post by tiger40 on Jan 25, 2021 14:43:41 GMT -5
I've always loved Roll It Over, it's such a great song and certainly one of Oasis's best album closers. Infact it's probably their best album closer from the 2000's and one of the best songs Noel has ever written. As for the demo version I've always liked it but i think that the album version is much better.
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Post by Lennon2217 on Jan 25, 2021 16:06:41 GMT -5
In all the time I've been an Oasis fan, I've always thought Roll It Over is a good song. But never have I gone through a phase where it is my favourite for a certain time. Until now that is (maybe it's something to do with the fact I'm now 30!). It's so brilliantly melancholy. I know we often criticise Oasis (or Noel) for making songs too plodding (e.g. criminally making Let There Be Love so snooze inducing), but the slower pace of this just suits the vibe perfectly. It's world weary but still defiant. But yet again, Liam's vocals are just epic. The demo doesn't much interest me, Noel's vocals just don't pull you in as to the potential of the song, but Liam delivers it and then some. The production, like a lot of the album, is flawless. Multilayered and sonically interesting - nice guitar riff, big reverb on the laid back drumming style of Alan White (a huuuuge part in making Oasis songs sound sophisticated), gospel choir for the final chorus and I love that drone effect you hear in the fade out (is it a distorted guitar effect?). Interestingly, the credits state 'sonic guidance by Mark Coyle'. I believe this was the last album he worked on with Oasis? We all know the false starts in him trying to initially produce Definitely Maybe but if he did indeed have influence on the sound of Oasis albums, then you can't fault his efforts. I don't have any major issues with the sound of any of the first four Oasis albums (I can even forgive Be Here Now for its overproduction). Just when you thought they were going to evolve, they then went on to make their most musically timid albums in HC, DBTT and DOYS. Coincided with Mark Coyle ending his association with the band maybe (unless he worked on subsequent ones of which I'm unaware of)? I've had the song on repeat for a few days now. Definitely in the top 5 Oasis songs from 2000 onwards. For the heights it reaches, Giants is definitely the fourth best Oasis album, and far better than any of the half-baked dross albums that followed. I could be mistaken but I believe Mark began to suffer from immense ear damage which impacted what he could offer production wise. |
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Post by oasisunited on Jan 25, 2021 16:16:57 GMT -5
I could be mistaken but I believe Mark began to suffer from immense ear damage which impacted what he could offer production wise. Yes -- he definitely suffered from hearing loss which lead him to quit touring with the band mid 1995. I doubt though that would have prevented him from helping in post production had Noel wanted him involved. My guess is that Mark probably hung out with Noel while he was demoing stuff for SOTSOG and being a friend, gave him a shout out on the liner notes. I doubt Mark went to France and I don't remember ever seeing any pictures of him hanging around in the various studio sessions for SOTSOG. |
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Post by Lennon2217 on Jan 25, 2021 16:29:26 GMT -5
I could be mistaken but I believe Mark began to suffer from immense ear damage which impacted what he could offer production wise. Yes -- he definitely suffered from hearing loss which lead him to quit touring with the band mid 1995. I doubt though that would have prevented him from helping in post production had Noel wanted him involved. My guess is that Mark probably hung out with Noel while he was demoing stuff for SOTSOG and being a friend, gave him a shout out on the liner notes. I doubt Mark went to France and I don't remember ever seeing any pictures of him hanging around in the various studio sessions for SOTSOG. I recently saw Sound of Metal and now any mention of hearing loss/damage freaks me out. |
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Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5
Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5