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Post by spaneli on Dec 26, 2014 17:00:06 GMT -5
Lennon was Tom Brady. McCartney was Peyton Manning. Considering McCartney has played larger gigs, had bigger albums, and bigger hits it should be the other way around  Especially because Lennon's judgment has to be constantly questioned |
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Post by matt on Dec 26, 2014 17:10:01 GMT -5
Well, it's a matter of opinion for Beatles fans as to which one album is their best, so I don't know how you can say 'the ones who most like The Beatles say Revolver' considering how subjective this argument has always been (besides, Paul features heavily on the arguably the two best songs - Eleanor Rigby and Tomorrow Never Knows). Whatever anyone's opinion of Sgt Pepper, there is no getting away from the fact that the album is a major milestone in music. And we have Paul to thank for that. Also, while John was off making bollocks like Two Virgins with Yoko, Paul was steadying the ship and Abbey Road would have been a complete mess without Paul and George Martin taking hold of it. John was off his head at the time and god only knows what mess The Beatles would have been stewing in if he had bossed about instead of Paul. I cannot understand how anyone thinks Lennon is far superior while seemingly oblivious to Paul's major impact, particularly towards the end. And if Let It Be wasn't what Paul had in mind, well where was Lennon's output and ideas then? Him and Harrison were big fans of Spector, but from what I hear, Spector's production was saccharine and overproduced nonsense and McCartney was right to be appalled at Spector. At least Paul had plans and big ideas for the band towards the last few years which more often than not contributed greatly to their legacy rather than hinder. Let It Be era? Johnny was too busy cooking up these bad boys....... - Don't Let Me Down - The Ballad of John and Yoko - Dig A Pony - Dig It (8 minute version) - Come Together - I Want You - Because - Mean Mr. Mustard - Polythene Pam - Give Peace A Chance - Cold Turkey And that's coming off 1968 when he wrote these........ - Across The Universe - Hey Bulldog - Revolution - Dear Prudence - Glass Onion - The Continuing Story of Bungalow Bill - Julia - Happiness Is A Warm Gun - I'm So Tired - Yer Blues - Everybody's Got Something To Hide Except For Me and My Monkey - Sexy Sadie - Cry Baby Cry Not an issue of writing, but ideas as concepts is what I mean. In the song writing, McCartney was well on par with. But do you not think Give Peace A Chance is a bang average tune? Not only is it repetitive, but it's a go to song of what people think represents Lennon, when it oversimplifies the man and misleads on impressions of him (an impression Yoko sure loves to milk and mythologise) I'm not sure how you can bang on about love and peace when his own life was blighted by moments of wickedness, in addition to neglecting his first born son Julian - who is open as to how bad a father he was (in addition to Yoko being very manipulative). Immensely troubled and complex, Plastic Ono Band I think gives a more honest account of him. |
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Post by matt on Dec 26, 2014 17:15:54 GMT -5
Toward the end John was the worst judge of the people around him. From Yoko interfering, to him having full trust in Spector up until Spector pulled a gun on him while recording Imagine, to him bringing in that crook Allen Klien. All three moves Paul vehemently disagreed over, especially the hiring of Klien as manager. Paul was the only Beatle not to sign the contract. John as a person with a strong judgment of character had completely deteriorated by the end. Bill Burr puts it best about Yoko! Proof if need be John had lost all common sense and by this time was well past his peak. |
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Post by Ebby Calvin 'Nuke' LaLoosh on Dec 26, 2014 17:17:31 GMT -5
I, uh, only recently picked up All Things Must Pass. I really had no reason for not getting it until now, just never did.
I'd heard songs like 'All Things Must Pass' and 'My Sweet Lord', etc.
But yeah, it's a great album. I normally listen to music on 'shuffle', so I'm slowly hearing the whole album. I figure by about the year 2067 I'll have heard the whole thing; I need to just listen to the album straight through but whatever.
For instance today, I heard 'Isn't It A Pity' for the first time, wow. And I had heard 'What Is Life', which is in the movie Goodfellas, but I didn't realize it was a George Harrison song. Whoops....
God bless.
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Post by jordan71421 on Dec 26, 2014 17:23:00 GMT -5
Toward the end John was the worst judge of the people around him. From Yoko interfering, to him having full trust in Spector up until Spector pulled a gun on him while recording Imagine, to him bringing in that crook Allen Klien. All three moves Paul vehemently disagreed over, especially the hiring of Klien as manager. Paul was the only Beatle not to sign the contract. John as a person with a strong judgment of character had completely deteriorated by the end. Bill Burr puts it best about Yoko! Proof if need be John had lost all common sense and by this time was well past his peak. Bill Burr is so damn funny, he's one of my favorite comedians |
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Post by spaneli on Dec 26, 2014 17:26:22 GMT -5
Plastic One Band really is his masterpiece. I don't think a bad word can be said of it.
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Post by theyknowwhatimean on Dec 26, 2014 17:43:08 GMT -5
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Post by Lennon2217 on Dec 26, 2014 18:09:10 GMT -5
Plastic One Band really is his masterpiece. I don't think a bad word can be said of it. |
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Post by Lennon2217 on Dec 26, 2014 18:12:49 GMT -5
I, uh, only recently picked up All Things Must Pass. I really had no reason for not getting it until now, just never did. I'd heard songs like 'All Things Must Pass' and 'My Sweet Lord', etc. But yeah, it's a great album. I normally listen to music on 'shuffle', so I'm slowly hearing the whole album. I figure by about the year 2067 I'll have heard the whole thing; I need to just listen to the album straight through but whatever. For instance today, I heard 'Isn't It A Pity' for the first time, wow. And I had heard 'What Is Life', which is in the movie Goodfellas, but I didn't realize it was a George Harrison song. Whoops.... God bless. All Things Must Pass is rather brilliant despite LP #3 being a complete waste of time. George never came close to this type of creative output again. Granted a ton of his album was back burner Beatle tunes that never got a day In the starting lineup.  |
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Post by Headmaster on Dec 26, 2014 19:37:17 GMT -5
About Sgt Peppers, yeah Paul was the driving force behind it, it is a great album, but also it's a bit overrated, if both Penny Lane or Strawberry Fields were on it it could have been their masterpiece with no contest. Who likes The Beatles use to say that Sgt Peppers is their best album, but who really knows them tells a different story, and they say Revolver is their best, an album where John was the driving force behind. I like them both, Paul is a better melodicist, and John's songs resonates better, on The Beatles they pushed each other to their limits of music and sound, to put an end to this draw I think John's solo carerr fared better than Paul's, as I've explained before why. Well, it's a matter of opinion for Beatles fans as to which one album is their best, so I don't know how you can say 'the ones who most like The Beatles say Revolver' considering how subjective this argument has always been (besides, Paul features heavily on the arguably the two best songs - Eleanor Rigby and Tomorrow Never Knows). Whatever anyone's opinion of Sgt Pepper, there is no getting away from the fact that the album is a major milestone in music. And we have Paul to thank for that. Also, while John was off making bollocks like Two Virgins with Yoko, Paul was steadying the ship and Abbey Road would have been a complete mess without Paul and George Martin taking hold of it. John was off his head at the time and god only knows what mess The Beatles would have been stewing in if he had bossed about instead of Paul. I cannot understand how anyone thinks Lennon is far superior while seemingly oblivious to Paul's major impact, particularly towards the end. And if Let It Be wasn't what Paul had in mind, well where was Lennon's output and ideas then? Him and Harrison were big fans of Spector, but from what I hear, Spector's production was saccharine and overproduced nonsense and McCartney was right to be appalled at Spector. At least Paul had plans and big ideas for the band towards the last few years which more often than not contributed greatly to their legacy rather than hinder. Paul only took the lead during their latter years, it doesn't make him the best out of the two, John was the driving force behind the band up untill Revolver, so then Paul's time came after that, I guess John's head was out of the band at the time, but also it doesn't make him the worst one. On White Album they were equals, on Abbey Road Paul came with that medley idea at the end, but John wrote the best song on it, and Let it Be came when the band wans't around anymore, so John didn't give a fuck. Thats' why on The Beatles they were considered equals, but John's solo carerr is what put an end to this draw, he wrote much more memorable songs solo than Paul's, it's what I have said before, while John wrote something like Mother and Imagine, Paul came with Live and Let Die(famous more because of that 007 movie) and Coming Up, and during the 80's Paul did many shit albums. |
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Post by Mean Mrs. Mustard on Dec 27, 2014 6:55:46 GMT -5
I see a lot of posts about Allen Klein, but if you really like to know what happened after the break up, with the money and Klein and the Beatles and all the court cases, then I'd recommend you to read Peter Doggett's You Never Give Me Your Money. It gives a lot of insight.
Another brilliant book about the Beatles in general is Marc Lewisohn's All These Years: Tune In, which is about their youth, how they met and the Beatles up until the 31st of December, 1962. Lewisohn writes brilliant books about The Beatles anyway. He's connected and has access to a lot of documents.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2014 9:18:04 GMT -5
I see a lot of posts about Allen Klein, but if you really like to know what happened after the break up, with the money and Klein and the Beatles and all the court cases, then I'd recommend you to read Peter Doggett's You Never Give Me Your Money. It gives a lot of insight. Another brilliant book about the Beatles in general is Marc Lewisohn's All These Years: Tune In, which is about their youth, how they met and the Beatles up until the 31st of December, 1962. Lewisohn writes brilliant books about The Beatles anyway. He's connected and has access to a lot of documents. cheers for the tip ...this just makes PETER GRANT ( RIP ). More of a legend than I thought ......he fought for LED Zeppelin tirelessly , physically went after the street vendors for selling bootleg ZEP concert shirts , made them them obscenely Rich and never stole a penny , he was a sorta shady , a thug , huge in size , but if you were his client you never got ripped off , all of Zep including bonzo's wife and kids attended his funeral along with bad company who at the time were on bad terms as well. But all came out for peter's send off ...shame tney didn't pick as wisely |
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Post by Lennon2217 on Dec 27, 2014 10:23:15 GMT -5
My parents take on The Beatles last night.....
Dad - John just looked so fucking cool all the time.
Mom - I always thought Paul was the cutest.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2014 10:33:21 GMT -5
My parents take on The Beatles last night..... Dad - John just looked so fucking cool all the time. Paul - I always thought he was the cutest. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ And that my friends is what it has always been about since the beginning ..... you could post all you want about who's style is superior , who' took control more post 1966 , WHOS so,o carrer had more meaning What Lennon2217 parents said up there is what every generation of fans have said , from the original beatlemania generation to the now so called " hipster generation ". None of it matters but that up top. And if you think John looked so cool all the time , no amount of "band on the run " will change your mind as to who's better , But im sure the debate will rage on long after this generation , and it still will only boil down to John looked cool and paul is cute .... |
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Post by Lennon2217 on Dec 27, 2014 12:19:37 GMT -5
Define irony............
The Beatles "White Album" is officially titled "The Beatles" yet they only appear together on 14 of 30 songs. Nice.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2014 12:22:21 GMT -5
Post 65 Macca was the main creative force in The Beatles and provided the flesh of their masterpiece albums with indelible melodies and simplistic often storytelling lyrics - but it was Lennon's genius in different areas and lyrical themes that made these albums soar and reach the levels they are now generally regarded to be at. In terms of solo career neither were stellar but personally I'd take "Mother" over anything Macca has done. I'd take "How Do You Sleep?" over any of the schmaltzy shite Macca has produced since "Band on the Run" and while Lennon's work can often seem egotistical, cliched and contradictory at least he never wrote "Wonderful Christmas Time".
I go Lennon.
Best Macca tunes:
Yesterday
Hey Jude
Eleanor Rigby
Let It Be
She's Leaving Home / Sgt. Peppers Lonely Hearts Club Band
Best Lennon tunes:
A Day in the Life
I am the Walrus
Strawberry Fields Forever
Imagine
Mother/Tomorrow Never Knows
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Post by Lennon2217 on Dec 29, 2014 13:33:17 GMT -5
I've been ripping through my Lennon solo albums over the Christmas holiday. Going in order with the ones I own (Plastic Ono Band, Imagine, Sometime In New York City, Mind Games). What an extreme drop off from Imagine to Sometime In New York. That had to annoy fans in late 1972. Probably expected an Imagine part II. Such a shame really. Would have been cool for Lennon to properly follow up Imagine. I get that Sometime In New York was a sign of the times and where his head was at but that album truly has some shit music on it.
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Post by theyknowwhatimean on Jan 3, 2015 8:24:04 GMT -5
Had Lennon not been shot down needlessly by some yank with a gun and a few screws loose, and instead been allowed to live and grow old like the rest, you wouldn't find HIM at 70, recording a song with a complete fucktard like Kayne "Yeezy" West, desperate to try and stay relevant when he's not made a good record since the seventies
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Post by Lennon2217 on Jan 3, 2015 8:34:14 GMT -5
Had Lennon not been shot down needlessly by some yank with a gun and a few screws loose, and instead been allowed to live and grow old like the rest, you wouldn't find HIM at 70, recording a song with a complete fucktard like Kayne "Yeezy" West, desperate to try and stay relevant when he's not made a good record since the seventies Oh I could totally see Lennon collaborating with a bunch of different artists as he got older. He started doing it before he died with Bowie, Elton John and Cheap Trick. |
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Post by theyknowwhatimean on Jan 3, 2015 8:37:58 GMT -5
Had Lennon not been shot down needlessly by some yank with a gun and a few screws loose, and instead been allowed to live and grow old like the rest, you wouldn't find HIM at 70, recording a song with a complete fucktard like Kayne "Yeezy" West, desperate to try and stay relevant when he's not made a good record since the seventies Oh I could totally see Lennon collaborating with a bunch of different artists as he got older. He started doing it before he died with Bowie, Elton John and Cheap Trick. Exactly, he collaborated with "artists". Real musicians, with real talent. Not some douchebag producer (well there was Spector, now I think of it but you know what I mean) |
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Post by Lennon2217 on Jan 3, 2015 8:40:08 GMT -5
Oh I could totally see Lennon collaborating with a bunch of different artists as he got older. He started doing it before he died with Bowie, Elton John and Cheap Trick. Exactly, he collaborated with "artists". Real musicians, with real talent. Not some douchebag producer (well there was Spector, now I think of it but you know what I mean) Kanye is a great many things but talentless is not among them. |
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Post by theyknowwhatimean on Jan 3, 2015 8:49:22 GMT -5
Exactly, he collaborated with "artists". Real musicians, with real talent. Not some douchebag producer (well there was Spector, now I think of it but you know what I mean) Kanye is a great many things but talentless is not among them. I never said he was necessarily talentless, he is a mean producer, that much is certain. But when compared to the likes of Bowie, he hardly stacks up does he? Nothing like the songwriting prowess of Bowie, and certainly nothing like the vocal abilities of Bowie or Elton John, for that manner. All the "nigga"s and "bitch"s and other vulgarities in his writing just adds to the embarrassment of the washed-up, whimsical love song writing, seventy Paul McCartney, collaborating with such a man |
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Post by Lennon2217 on Jan 3, 2015 8:51:20 GMT -5
Kanye is a great many things but talentless is not among them. I never said he was necessarily talentless, he is a mean producer, that much is certain. But when compared to the likes of Bowie, he hardly stacks up does he? Nothing like the songwriting prowess of Bowie, and certainly nothing like the vocal abilities of Bowie or Elton John, for that manner. All the "nigga"s and "bitch"s and other vulgarities in his writing just adds to the embarrassment of the washed-up, whimsical love song writing, seventy Paul McCartney, collaborating with such a man Lennon and Tupac would have been best friends. |
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Post by Sternumman on Jan 3, 2015 9:12:07 GMT -5
Toward the end John was the worst judge of the people around him. From Yoko interfering, to him having full trust in Spector up until Spector pulled a gun on him while recording Imagine, to him bringing in that crook Allen Klien. All three moves Paul vehemently disagreed over, especially the hiring of Klien as manager. Paul was the only Beatle not to sign the contract. John as a person with a strong judgment of character had completely deteriorated by the end. Bill Burr puts it best about Yoko! Proof if need be John had lost all common sense and by this time was well past his peak. That is hilarious. |
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Post by Sternumman on Jan 3, 2015 9:13:01 GMT -5
I never said he was necessarily talentless, he is a mean producer, that much is certain. But when compared to the likes of Bowie, he hardly stacks up does he? Nothing like the songwriting prowess of Bowie, and certainly nothing like the vocal abilities of Bowie or Elton John, for that manner. All the "nigga"s and "bitch"s and other vulgarities in his writing just adds to the embarrassment of the washed-up, whimsical love song writing, seventy Paul McCartney, collaborating with such a man Lennon and Tupac would have been best friends.  |
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