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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2019 14:03:24 GMT -5
Forgetting everything else, if I was in a band with someone and they were leaking stories about me to the scumbags at the Sun I'd have a big problem with it. And that's the story that Liam has (I believe it). Noel has stories about Liam (I believe those as well). The truth, as we all know, will be somewhere in the middle of what both of them say. |
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2019 14:04:33 GMT -5
As It Was isn't about slagging Noel off. But when it comes to throwing shit, Noel's already thrown too much shits to Liam with the media during the Oasis era. Especially around 2008-2009, Noel talked too much shits about Liam to the press, not only to his journalist mate but also to the various press interviews. Most of his interviews had that shit, as far as I remember. And don't forget his shitty press conference. I don't mind if Liam's got his own version of story to defend himself or hurt the other brother. Noel'd got the media, and now Liam's got the twitter. They just keep doing the same to each other in their own way. Can we stop this line of thought that Noel is a puppet master in charge of the media. It was bigged up in the film too much. He isn't. He just isn't as impulsive as Liam and knows how to use people more, probably. They both were - and still are - at fault. |
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2019 14:08:41 GMT -5
The best thing about Twitter, Liam's comeback and subsequent higher profile is we get to hear his side of the story. A huge part of the problem around the break up of Oasis is Noel controlled the media narrative for almost 20 years. Liam has been consistent since 2009 about Gordan Smart hanging about, being mates with Noel and printing stories leaked by Noel / Sara. This is Liam's turn to tell a part of the story from his view, it's bound to not agree with everyone. I get where you are coming from with this perspective, but I still have issues with it. It would be perfectly acceptable if we were talking about someone that had no means to defend himself. This is not the case with Liam. Liam had a high profile back then. As high as Noel's. I don't believe journalists wouldn't have given him the time of day for an interview, had Liam wanted to set the record straight and tell his side of the story. It is not like he was an annonymous with no voice outside social media. Exactly this. The film - to an extent - makes Liam out to be helpless. He was only 'helpless' in those years after Oasis because he was every bit a parody of himself. Beady Eye were a parody of themselves and that's one of the reasons it never worked. I didn't mind the bits where Liam had a dig at Noel. He has every right to be angry. It's the people around him in the film (bar Debbie) who seemed to do it more. I get that it was probably just a very small part of every interview they did, like, and that they have mostly valid points, but I couldn't help feel that the film made Liam out to be a 'victim' too much. I'm glad Liam and Debbie both had the final say that actually, he wasn't a victim. Heck, how could he be, he's Liam bloody Gallagher. |
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2019 14:11:13 GMT -5
Most normal human beings grow out of this phase by their early 20s. Anybody over the age of about 22 who still carries on like this is a prize nobhead of the highest order and needs their head kicking in. And I think that even applies to Liam himself in all honesty. The way he carries himself for a bloke approaching 50 is painfully cringey. Liam's mellowed out loads. He's one of the last great rock stars. Quite happy with him as he is, cheers. |
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2019 14:11:47 GMT -5
5 mins into the film and well, what a way to manipulate history. I guess that's what his "fans" expect, blaming it all on Noel, quietly putting on aside his 20 years of excess and shit behavior (maybe later in the film ?). How easy. For me, it'll still be 50/50. many thanx to Thomas, the uploader. People wants to be Liam, not Noel. Est. 1994 and without manipulation. Fact. I'd much rather have been Noel purely because I don't think I could handle the amount of gear Liam has done. |
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2019 14:14:45 GMT -5
What makes me laugh is I could actually tell you exactly the members who wouldn't really like Shockwave or As It Was before they were released. It's proper weird. TBF, you could flip that round too mate. You can know exactly the ones who will hate anything Noel and love anything Liam. I really like Shockwave. It's a banger and a great comeback single. Not sure if it's sustainable for Liam to keep singing about how much he hates a certain someone like but thankfully from what we know that's not gonna be what the album's about and that's great. I enjoyed AIW. I think it suffered a bit from trying to replicate Supersonic in terms of the really emotional moments, but it never quite got there, and then as I've said certain other bits where for my liking it focused too much on other things rather than Liam himself. But it's a good film and I'll be watching it again soon enough. The best bits - and I said this right away on Sunday after watching it - were when Liam was just being himself and being a funny fucker. |
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Post by tomlivesforever on Jun 11, 2019 14:18:16 GMT -5
The impression I got from Paul's bits of the film was that he felt that Noel should've prioritised family ties over everything that came before when Liam started circling the drain. Yeh which is fair enough. But it seemed that the main thing about that bit was that it was going to be Liam asking Noel to get Oasis back together? Like, would that really have been good? Surely that would have just made things worse really. The fact Liam needed to crawl to Noel to get Oasis back together. It would just have made Noel 'win'. I'm not defending Noel for not even picking up the phone or whatever. I'm not blaming Liam. I'm just glad he got himself out of his own hole. You could put it like that. You could also put it as someone asking for help from their brother when they were desperate. |
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Post by tomlivesforever on Jun 11, 2019 14:22:22 GMT -5
What makes me laugh is I could actually tell you exactly the members who wouldn't really like Shockwave or As It Was before they were released. It's proper weird. TBF, you could flip that round too mate. You can know exactly the ones who will hate anything Noel and love anything Liam. I really like Shockwave. It's a banger and a great comeback single. Not sure if it's sustainable for Liam to keep singing about how much he hates a certain someone like but thankfully from what we know that's not gonna be what the album's about and that's great. I enjoyed AIW. I think it suffered a bit from trying to replicate Supersonic in terms of the really emotional moments, but it never quite got there, and then as I've said certain other bits where for my liking it focused too much on other things rather than Liam himself. But it's a good film and I'll be watching it again soon enough. The best bits - and I said this right away on Sunday after watching it - were when Liam was just being himself and being a funny fucker. Yeah all things being equal which they aren't. There are of course similar people from each but the trolls in here are worse. Check the last two pages for confirmation. |
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Post by fartpanic on Jun 11, 2019 14:26:32 GMT -5
Then why are you watching a documentary about him? That's a pretty poor argument. There are plenty of people I'm not a fan of but would happily watch a documentary about to gain some insight into their story. Liking someone isn't a prerequisite for watching a film about them. I'm hoping that the documentary provides some sort of insight into why he still feels the needs to act like a 21 year old at the age of 46, maybe show a bit more of a human side to him. And I'm also hoping for some further details on the Oasis split and "that" night in Paris. Plus Bonehead is in at as well and he is always good value for money. He's a rock star. If he was acting that way in McDonald's and throwing burgers at customers and telling people to fuck off in the drive thru then there might be a problem. But you only have to look at how many idolize him and love him to see hes doing just fine the way he is. He isn't asking for you to like him. |
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Post by bogaloo on Jun 11, 2019 14:56:08 GMT -5
TBF, you could flip that round too mate. You can know exactly the ones who will hate anything Noel and love anything Liam. I really like Shockwave. It's a banger and a great comeback single. Not sure if it's sustainable for Liam to keep singing about how much he hates a certain someone like but thankfully from what we know that's not gonna be what the album's about and that's great. I enjoyed AIW. I think it suffered a bit from trying to replicate Supersonic in terms of the really emotional moments, but it never quite got there, and then as I've said certain other bits where for my liking it focused too much on other things rather than Liam himself. But it's a good film and I'll be watching it again soon enough. The best bits - and I said this right away on Sunday after watching it - were when Liam was just being himself and being a funny fucker. Yeah all things being equal which they aren't. There are of course similar people from each but the trolls in here are worse. Check the last two pages for confirmation. With all due respect Tom, they don't seem equal, to you. Only someone absolutely unbiased toward either of them can make that judgement correctly. Peace x |
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Post by Stemot on Jun 11, 2019 15:04:55 GMT -5
Jesus fucking Christ. XD
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Post by RUBIKON on Jun 11, 2019 15:10:05 GMT -5
Think I enjoyed the extras on the Blu-ray as much as the film
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Post by tomlivesforever on Jun 11, 2019 15:14:18 GMT -5
Yeah all things being equal which they aren't. There are of course similar people from each but the trolls in here are worse. Check the last two pages for confirmation. With all due respect Tom, they don't seem equal, to you. Only someone absolutely unbiased toward either of them can make that judgement correctly. Peace x The brothers? No of course there not, how many disputes are absolutely straight down the line 50/50? Pretty much none I'd say. Now I may have it the wrong way round not being a fly on the wall but 50/50? Nah that's just an easy out. I'm on safer ground in regard to what I say about the forum. Its long running and little has changed. |
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Post by oasismashups on Jun 11, 2019 15:20:52 GMT -5
After watching it, I came to the conclusion that Liam really loves:
-his missus
-his children
-his brother Paul
-his mother
-and a good ol' acoustic guitar with a capo on the 4th fret
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Post by bogaloo on Jun 11, 2019 15:29:08 GMT -5
With all due respect Tom, they don't seem equal, to you. Only someone absolutely unbiased toward either of them can make that judgement correctly. Peace x The brothers? No of course there not, how many disputes are absolutely straight down the line 50/50? Pretty much none I'd say. Now I may have it the wrong way round not being a fly on the wall but 50/50? Nah that's just an easy out. I'm on safer ground in regard to what I say about the forum. Its long running and little has changed. No, not the brothers!I meant what you said about "all things being equal" and "the trolls". What I meant is, we, as fans may lean towards one side or the other of the argument, hence, when someone that leans towards Liam tends to see it as being "worse" when the forum "Liam-bashing mode is on" and vice versa. We, as fans, are not neutral enough to say which "trolling" is worse. I apologise in advance if this is not what you meant, but it seemed to me you stated it very matter of factly, and I don't think that is such clearly the case. |
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Post by tomlivesforever on Jun 11, 2019 15:39:28 GMT -5
The brothers? No of course there not, how many disputes are absolutely straight down the line 50/50? Pretty much none I'd say. Now I may have it the wrong way round not being a fly on the wall but 50/50? Nah that's just an easy out. I'm on safer ground in regard to what I say about the forum. Its long running and little has changed. No, not the brothers!I meant what you said about "all things being equal" and "the trolls". What I meant is, we, as fans may lean towards one side or the other of the argument, hence, when someone that leans towards Liam tends to see it as being "worse" when the forum "Liam-bashing mode is on" and vice versa. We, as fans, are not neutral enough to say which "trolling" is worse. I apologise in advance if this is not what you meant, but it seemed to me you stated it very matter of factly, and I don't think that is such clearly the case. It is worse, absolutely 100%. I'm neutral enough to realise many years ago I was one of those pricks that spent to much time winding people up in the Noel forum and I've made a conscious decision that if I didn't have anything good to say I wouldn't bother posting there. Mainly I've stuck to this and fans of Noel Gallagher in his section are all the better for it, as am I. So yeah I think I'm pretty good at evaluating who's doing what and why on here. And I notice you signed up 2017, I'm going back quite a bit further than that. |
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Post by mancraider on Jun 11, 2019 16:02:27 GMT -5
I've not been a regular reader as long as yourself but I've been around in one form or another since 2011. I kinda think there are equal amount of trolls on both sides but they tend to operate differently which is why there seems to be bias. Trolls tend to copy the characteristics of their Gallagher of choice, so Liam trolls are rude and in your face whereas Noel trolls tend to be more smug and act as if they are more intelligent and have more refined musical knowledge. The former are more likely to breach the forum rules and get banned so it can seem like there is and unfair bias which I don't believe there really is.
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Post by bogaloo on Jun 11, 2019 16:07:12 GMT -5
No, not the brothers!I meant what you said about "all things being equal" and "the trolls". What I meant is, we, as fans may lean towards one side or the other of the argument, hence, when someone that leans towards Liam tends to see it as being "worse" when the forum "Liam-bashing mode is on" and vice versa. We, as fans, are not neutral enough to say which "trolling" is worse. I apologise in advance if this is not what you meant, but it seemed to me you stated it very matter of factly, and I don't think that is such clearly the case. It is worse, absolutely 100%. I'm neutral enough to realise many years ago I was one of those pricks that spent to much time winding people up in the Noel forum and I've made a conscious decision that if I didn't have anything good to say I wouldn't bother posting there. Mainly I've stuck to this and fans of Noel Gallagher in his section are all the better for it, as am I. So yeah I think I'm pretty good at evaluating who's doing what and why on here. And I notice you signed up 2017, I'm going back quite a bit further than that. OK, I'll give you this, I've been reading this forum way before you started posting. It's where I got my oasis updates from since god knows when. I just didn't really feel any motivation to actually login and post. If you are harking back to the Beady Eye trolling days, then I fully agree. I vividly remember shutting down my laptop thinking "please...Stop kicking a dead body", when everybody seemed to have decided Beady Eye were shit. Those days are long gone though, and I'd hazard a guess, those were not "Noel Gallagher fans", those were probably "jump on the bandwagon on top fans". Also, I notice that many of the "Noel Gallagher fans" that didn't seem as trolls to me (I accept I may be wrong, though), simply don't post here anymore. So I don't think it is that unbalanced at all. If anything, I'd hazard a guess it's the other way around nowadays, but I won't state it as a fact, because it may be just how I feel regarding this, because I am, as you are, a fan. And we will always look at it though tinted glasses just of slightly different colours. |
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Post by tomlivesforever on Jun 11, 2019 16:14:48 GMT -5
It is worse, absolutely 100%. I'm neutral enough to realise many years ago I was one of those pricks that spent to much time winding people up in the Noel forum and I've made a conscious decision that if I didn't have anything good to say I wouldn't bother posting there. Mainly I've stuck to this and fans of Noel Gallagher in his section are all the better for it, as am I. So yeah I think I'm pretty good at evaluating who's doing what and why on here. And I notice you signed up 2017, I'm going back quite a bit further than that. OK, I'll give you this, I've been reading this forum way before you started posting. It's where I got my oasis updates from since god knows when. I just didn't really feel any motivation to actually login and post. If you are harking back to the Beady Eye trolling days, then I fully agree. I vividly remember shutting down my laptop thinking "please...Stop kicking a dead body", when everybody seemed to have decided Beady Eye were shit. Those days are long gone though, and I'd hazard a guess, those were not "Noel Gallagher fans", those were probably "jump on the bandwagon on top fans". Also, I notice that many of the "Noel Gallagher fans" that actually didn't seem as trolls to me (I accept I may be wrong, though), simply don't post here anymore. So there I don't think it is that unbalanced at all. If anything, I'd hazard a guess it's the other way around nowadays, but I won't state it as a fact, because it may be just how I feel regarding this, because I am, as you are, a fan. And we will always look at it though tinted glasses just of slightly different colours. Haha one of those from the beady eye days is back posting in this very thread. Same every time. Anyway we can agree to disagree on this. |
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Post by bogaloo on Jun 11, 2019 16:58:54 GMT -5
OK, I'll give you this, I've been reading this forum way before you started posting. It's where I got my oasis updates from since god knows when. I just didn't really feel any motivation to actually login and post. If you are harking back to the Beady Eye trolling days, then I fully agree. I vividly remember shutting down my laptop thinking "please...Stop kicking a dead body", when everybody seemed to have decided Beady Eye were shit. Those days are long gone though, and I'd hazard a guess, those were not "Noel Gallagher fans", those were probably "jump on the bandwagon on top fans". Also, I notice that many of the "Noel Gallagher fans" that actually didn't seem as trolls to me (I accept I may be wrong, though), simply don't post here anymore. So there I don't think it is that unbalanced at all. If anything, I'd hazard a guess it's the other way around nowadays, but I won't state it as a fact, because it may be just how I feel regarding this, because I am, as you are, a fan. And we will always look at it though tinted glasses just of slightly different colours. Haha one of those from the beady eye days is back posting in this very thread. Same every time. Anyway we can agree to disagree on this. One is not the majority, though ;-) Yeah, let's agree to disagree Anyway… Just one more thing, and to avoid quoting you, yet again, that thing you said, replying to bt95, regarding the not reforming oasis or "not helping" a "brother when they are desperate". My take is, unfortunately, sometimes no, you shouldn't help. I don't mean in this particular case, or whether in this case Noel did it for any of the right or wrong reasons, but sometimes, you shouldn't. It is not because you CAN help that you SHOULD be the one to help. Sometimes, people may come to you with no bad intentions at all, but not realising that they are doing it because that's the easy solution. In this case, this allowed Liam to grow. A lot. It took a hell of a lot of pain,certainly, but in hindsight, I suppose it was the best, for both of them. I hope you can agree to disagree in this one too. Peace x |
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Post by tomlivesforever on Jun 11, 2019 17:07:07 GMT -5
Haha one of those from the beady eye days is back posting in this very thread. Same every time. Anyway we can agree to disagree on this. One is not the majority, though ;-) Yeah, let's agree to disagree Anyway… Just one more thing, and to avoid quoting you, yet again, that thing you said, replying to bt95, regarding the not reforming oasis or "not helping" a "brother when they are desperate". My take is, unfortunately, sometimes no, you shouldn't help. I don't mean in this particular case, or whether in this case Noel did it for any of the right or wrong reasons, but sometimes, you shouldn't. It is not because you CAN help that you SHOULD be the one to help. Sometimes, people may come to you with no bad intentions at all, but not realising that they are doing it because that's the easy solution. In this case, this allowed Liam to grow. A lot. It took a hell of a lot of pain,certainly, but in hindsight, I suppose it was the best, for both of them. I hope you can agree to disagree in this one too. Peace x The one was an example, there are more who were here then who just by chance have showed up now. What a coincidence. I more meant that from the outside it’s easy to describe it as Liam crawling to Noel whereas from within the family like Peggy and Paul it’s probably not the way they would look at it. I respect your opinion. I can agree to disagree. |
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2019 17:29:48 GMT -5
It is worse, absolutely 100%. I'm neutral enough to realise many years ago I was one of those pricks that spent to much time winding people up in the Noel forum and I've made a conscious decision that if I didn't have anything good to say I wouldn't bother posting there. Mainly I've stuck to this and fans of Noel Gallagher in his section are all the better for it, as am I. So yeah I think I'm pretty good at evaluating who's doing what and why on here. And I notice you signed up 2017, I'm going back quite a bit further than that. OK, I'll give you this, I've been reading this forum way before you started posting. It's where I got my oasis updates from since god knows when. I just didn't really feel any motivation to actually login and post. If you are harking back to the Beady Eye trolling days, then I fully agree. I vividly remember shutting down my laptop thinking "please...Stop kicking a dead body", when everybody seemed to have decided Beady Eye were shit. Those days are long gone though, and I'd hazard a guess, those were not "Noel Gallagher fans", those were probably "jump on the bandwagon on top fans". Also, I notice that many of the "Noel Gallagher fans" that didn't seem as trolls to me (I accept I may be wrong, though), simply don't post here anymore. So I don't think it is that unbalanced at all. If anything, I'd hazard a guess it's the other way around nowadays, but I won't state it as a fact, because it may be just how I feel regarding this, because I am, as you are, a fan. And we will always look at it though tinted glasses just of slightly different colours. It's like how fans of a footy team will always think refs have given them a harder game than the opposition. Just a natural thing. So yeh, saying one is worse than the other (in regards to the forum thing) is hard to judge objectively really. If pushed, I'm more of a Noel fan than Liam in terms of the music. But I'll acknowledge he can be a dick. I just don't think the stick he gets (sometimes) on here is fair, because whatever people think the two people who actually know the story are Noel and Liam and we can only really assume that the truth lies somewhere in the middle of what those two say. That's why one of my only minor disappointments with the film was that it strayed a bit into the blame game and I didn't think it was needed (not as much as it was used at least, because I acknowledge it had to play a part). |
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2019 17:34:21 GMT -5
Yeh which is fair enough. But it seemed that the main thing about that bit was that it was going to be Liam asking Noel to get Oasis back together? Like, would that really have been good? Surely that would have just made things worse really. The fact Liam needed to crawl to Noel to get Oasis back together. It would just have made Noel 'win'. I'm not defending Noel for not even picking up the phone or whatever. I'm not blaming Liam. I'm just glad he got himself out of his own hole. You could put it like that. You could also put it as someone asking for help from their brother when they were desperate. I'm not disputing that. But would that really have been the best way for an Oasis reunion to happen? Because Liam needed the money? I'm not saying Noel was thinking that when he refused to answer or whatever. Like not saying he's some benevolent being. All we know is they don't like each other. You can't blame Noel and you can't blame Liam. They just don't get on. Noel has every right to make the decisions he has done in terms of his relationship with his brother(s), just as anyone else does. We can all think he's made a dickish move or whatever (like not letting the Oasis songs in AIW) but at the same time he has every right to do it. Just like Liam has every right to be mad at him or go call him a potato on Twitter. |
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2019 17:35:41 GMT -5
After watching it, I came to the conclusion that Liam really loves: -his missus -his children -his brother Paul -his mother - and a good ol' acoustic guitar with a capo on the 4th fret |
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Post by bogaloo on Jun 11, 2019 17:46:04 GMT -5
One is not the majority, though ;-) Yeah, let's agree to disagree Anyway… Just one more thing, and to avoid quoting you, yet again, that thing you said, replying to bt95 , regarding the not reforming oasis or "not helping" a "brother when they are desperate". My take is, unfortunately, sometimes no, you shouldn't help. I don't mean in this particular case, or whether in this case Noel did it for any of the right or wrong reasons, but sometimes, you shouldn't. It is not because you CAN help that you SHOULD be the one to help. Sometimes, people may come to you with no bad intentions at all, but not realising that they are doing it because that's the easy solution. In this case, this allowed Liam to grow. A lot. It took a hell of a lot of pain,certainly, but in hindsight, I suppose it was the best, for both of them. I hope you can agree to disagree in this one too. Peace x The one was an example, there are more who were here then who just by chance have showed up now. What a coincidence. I more meant that from the outside it’s easy to describe it as Liam crawling to Noel whereas from within the family like Peggy and Paul it’s probably not the way they would look at it.I respect your opinion. I can agree to disagree. Yeah, sure. I also think that happens, at least partially because this is how this family has been "primed" to act. It's their "resting mode" of operating. Honestly, maybe it's because I've seen too much, but if people like Thomas Gallagher and the likes of him could be isolated in a desert Island, far far away and impeded to breed in some kind of dystopic parallel future, the world would be a better place. |
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Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5