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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2018 18:47:10 GMT -5
Whether music's good or not and to what degree is subjective, so whenever I see any hyperbolic plaudits or criticisms, I just mentally add "In my opinion, ..." to the start of it* and all's well with the world again  *(which is an accurate addition for the vast majority of music reviews, except for basic descriptions like 'this song features this particular instrument/vocalist/producer/etc.' which are objective statements that aren't really the focus of a review in my opinion  ) |
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Post by jordan71421 on Jun 23, 2018 18:56:03 GMT -5
Whether music's good or not and to what degree is subjective, so whenever I see any hyperbolic plaudits or criticisms, I just mentally add "In my opinion, ..." to the start of it* and all's well with the world again *(which is an accurate addition for the vast majority of music reviews, except for basic descriptions like 'this song features this particular instrument/vocalist/producer/etc.' which are objective statements that aren't really the focus of a review in my opinion ) Yeah it’s a practice of mind to say “in my opinion’ as much as possible when talking about things like this |
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Post by The Escapist on Jun 23, 2018 19:04:46 GMT -5
Whether music's good or not and to what degree is subjective, so whenever I see any hyperbolic plaudits or criticisms, I just mentally add "In my opinion, ..." to the start of it* and all's well with the world again *(which is an accurate addition for the vast majority of music reviews, except for basic descriptions like 'this song features this particular instrument/vocalist/producer/etc.' which are objective statements that aren't really the focus of a review in my opinion ) Y'all know this is just my opinion right?  |
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Post by The Escapist on Jun 23, 2018 19:11:03 GMT -5
And it also really bothers me that Teyana's album (great as it is) is eight tracks when the other four have been seven.
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Post by theyknowwhatimean on Jun 25, 2018 9:08:39 GMT -5
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Post by jordan71421 on Jun 25, 2018 9:32:00 GMT -5
I do agree that it’s one of his better albums, but god, this was point when his lyrics really went downhill for me. I never really rated him as that great of a lyricist, but the awful sex puns from this album onwards make my skin crawl |
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Post by Lennon2217 on Jun 25, 2018 11:08:18 GMT -5
Can someone be proclaimed the best producer of this era when none of these recent releases will ever rival his best output or the output of the others just produced? I think not.
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Post by The Escapist on Jun 25, 2018 11:28:36 GMT -5
Big up Macca, what a legend. Apparently Kanye wanted to make a full album with him. I would have loved to see the face on all the middle-aged Beatles fans when he collaborated with Ye though . |
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Post by The Crimson Rambler on Jun 25, 2018 17:08:50 GMT -5
How many producers are credited on Yeezus? A lot is the answer. Industrial hip-hop has been done much better much earlier. Yeezus lacks in sharpness, detail, spontaneity and intensity. How you can say "I can't think of anyone else on earth who's producing anything near this standard" is just beyond me. And how many great songs are on Yeezus anyway? In answer to your question I don't know. It's too bold a statement I'd feel comfortable making. It's true Kanye worked with a lot of people to create the Yeezus sound but when you realise how he was able to orchestrate and utilise such disparate people as Bon Iver, Rick Rubin, and Arca to find his vision I honestly think it's just inspiring. Sounds like a very privileged individual with a lot of talent at his disposal. For me the more individuals there are the less inspiring it is. Sonically If I had to describe Yeezus in a word I'd call it 'Industrial'. Is it more than that? Yes, but I'm sure many 'Industrial Hip-Hop' albums are. Calling Death Grips 'Industrial Hip-Hop' is equally lazy. Speaking of Death Grips, I'd argue they pull off most of those adjectives better than Kanye ever did on Yeezus. Sure I'm no massive Kanye fan but I can respect that. The songs I like on Yeezus are as followed, favourite to least: Black Skinhead On Sight New Slaves Bound 2 I am a God Blood on the Leaves The only song I'd call great though is Black Skinhead. That's the clear stand out to me. And even then I'd say it could be improved from a production/performance standpoint. For me it's not wild, aggressive or claustrophobic enough. It's better live like that (5 star) performance from SNL you posted earlier. And as you've said before: live4ever.proboards.com/post/1465527 |
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Post by jordan71421 on Jun 25, 2018 17:14:33 GMT -5
It's true Kanye worked with a lot of people to create the Yeezus sound but when you realise how he was able to orchestrate and utilise such disparate people as Bon Iver, Rick Rubin, and Arca to find his vision I honestly think it's just inspiring. Sounds like a very privileged individual with a lot of talent at his disposal. For me the more individuals there are the less inspiring it is. Sonically If I had to describe Yeezus in a word I'd call it 'Industrial'. Is it more than that? Yes, but I'm sure many 'Industrial Hip-Hop' albums are. Calling Death Grips 'Industrial Hip-Hop' is equally lazy. Speaking of Death Grips, I'd argue they pull off most of those adjectives better than Kanye ever did on Yeezus. Sure I'm no massive Kanye fan but I can respect that. The songs I like on Yeezus are as followed, favourite to least: Black Skinhead On Sight New Slaves Bound 2 I am a God Blood on the Leaves The only song I'd call great though is Black Skinhead. That's the clear stand out to me. And even then I'd say it could be improved from a production/performance standpoint. For me it's not wild, aggressive or claustrophobic enough. It's better live like that (5 star) performance from SNL you posted earlier. And as you've said before: live4ever.proboards.com/post/1465527And for me, even though Black Skinhead has a great sound, the lyrics are terrible to me. No clear message, with awful puns (a Kanye tradition) |
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Post by The Escapist on Jun 25, 2018 20:47:35 GMT -5
It's true Kanye worked with a lot of people to create the Yeezus sound but when you realise how he was able to orchestrate and utilise such disparate people as Bon Iver, Rick Rubin, and Arca to find his vision I honestly think it's just inspiring. Sounds like a very privileged individual with a lot of talent at his disposal. For me the more individuals there are the less inspiring it is. Sonically If I had to describe Yeezus in a word I'd call it 'Industrial'. Is it more than that? Yes, but I'm sure many 'Industrial Hip-Hop' albums are. Calling Death Grips 'Industrial Hip-Hop' is equally lazy. Speaking of Death Grips, I'd argue they pull off most of those adjectives better than Kanye ever did on Yeezus. Sure I'm no massive Kanye fan but I can respect that. The songs I like on Yeezus are as followed, favourite to least: Black Skinhead On Sight New Slaves Bound 2 I am a God Blood on the Leaves The only song I'd call great though is Black Skinhead. That's the clear stand out to me. And even then I'd say it could be improved from a production/performance standpoint. For me it's not wild, aggressive or claustrophobic enough. It's better live like that (5 star) performance from SNL you posted earlier. And as you've said before: live4ever.proboards.com/post/1465527I honestly just don't get the Death Grips comparison, to me Yeezus sounds absolutely nothing like them and isn't trying to either - like I said, once you get the (fucking orgasmic) break in New Slaves, the album takes on a much more mid-tempo, atmospheric feel. I've always seen the album as Kanye painting himself as this Yeezus character - an ego-driven manic revolutionary (who we see from On Sight to the telling break in New Slaves, where the foreign language sample hidden beneath the drums is about a woman waiting beneath the water) who is internally being torn apart by loneliness and a need for love (Hold My Liquor through Blood on the Leaves) and finds a resolution being seemingly find a way to synthesise love with his ego (Guilt Trip through to the gorgeously corny and feel-good ending of Bound 2). It's not a perfect artistic statement but it is a powerful one, and the tone Kanye creates musically for it is one that is heavy, atmospheric, minimalist and in places just unspeakably beautiful. Worlds apart from the constantly manic, chaotic, and aggressive sound of Death Grips. And you don't like Hold My Liquor?? That might be my favourite song on the album, the tellingly vulnerable mid-point. Honestly, Yeezus is one of my all-time favourite albums so I could ramble all day about the amazing uses of song structure and aesthetics and narrative, but I can see why people wouldn't love it as much as I do. At the end of the day, it's Kanye at his most "Kanye", and the beauty of that lies close to how divisive it has to be. |
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Post by The Crimson Rambler on Jun 26, 2018 13:58:48 GMT -5
Sounds like a very privileged individual with a lot of talent at his disposal. For me the more individuals there are the less inspiring it is. Sonically If I had to describe Yeezus in a word I'd call it 'Industrial'. Is it more than that? Yes, but I'm sure many 'Industrial Hip-Hop' albums are. Calling Death Grips 'Industrial Hip-Hop' is equally lazy. Speaking of Death Grips, I'd argue they pull off most of those adjectives better than Kanye ever did on Yeezus. Sure I'm no massive Kanye fan but I can respect that. The songs I like on Yeezus are as followed, favourite to least: Black Skinhead On Sight New Slaves Bound 2 I am a God Blood on the Leaves The only song I'd call great though is Black Skinhead. That's the clear stand out to me. And even then I'd say it could be improved from a production/performance standpoint. For me it's not wild, aggressive or claustrophobic enough. It's better live like that (5 star) performance from SNL you posted earlier. And as you've said before: live4ever.proboards.com/post/1465527I honestly just don't get the Death Grips comparison, to me Yeezus sounds absolutely nothing like them and isn't trying to either - like I said, once you get the (fucking orgasmic) break in New Slaves, the album takes on a much more mid-tempo, atmospheric feel. I've always seen the album as Kanye painting himself as this Yeezus character - an ego-driven manic revolutionary (who we see from On Sight to the telling break in New Slaves, where the foreign language sample hidden beneath the drums is about a woman waiting beneath the water) who is internally being torn apart by loneliness and a need for love (Hold My Liquor through Blood on the Leaves) and finds a resolution being seemingly find a way to synthesise love with his ego (Guilt Trip through to the gorgeously corny and feel-good ending of Bound 2). It's not a perfect artistic statement but it is a powerful one, and the tone Kanye creates musically for it is one that is heavy, atmospheric, minimalist and in places just unspeakably beautiful. Worlds apart from the constantly manic, chaotic, and aggressive sound of Death Grips. A lot of the initial criticisms had a lot to do with timing. 'The Money Store' and 'No Love Deep Web' came out the year before 'Yeezus' and Death Grips were the new exciting thing in 'hip-hop' so Kanye's sudden left turn into similar electronic and industrial sounds came off as him jumping on the next big thing. Sonically I think there are obvious comparisons. Speaking of the break in New Slaves, yeah, I really like it but it's just an Omega song with some vocalist on top. How much genius is there really? Kanye didn't write the Omega song and I doubt whatever that lady's singing. Like I said, it's really nice, but he doesn't score big points there for me. Nah, not really. Neither here nor there with it. |
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Post by matt on Jun 26, 2018 17:46:48 GMT -5
Not that I doubt any of his followers claims, but what makes Kanye West stand out from all the other hip-hop artists, speaking as someone with absolutely no idea of the subject?
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Post by jordan71421 on Jun 26, 2018 18:08:19 GMT -5
Not that I doubt any of his followers claims, but what makes Kanye West stand out from all the other hip-hop artists, speaking as someone with absolutely no idea of the subject? In 2018, nothing honestly. Just my opinion. 2004-2007 though? Super creative |
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Post by The Escapist on Jun 27, 2018 12:41:02 GMT -5
Not that I doubt any of his followers claims, but what makes Kanye West stand out from all the other hip-hop artists, speaking as someone with absolutely no idea of the subject? He's like the Radiohead of hip-hop, constantly shifting his sound, pushing boundaries, generally just being a few steps ahead of everyone else with ridiculous consistency. He's made ten studio albums including collaborations and there's not a single one of them approaching bad - like Radiohead or perhaps for you Springsteen, his albums are almost impossible to rank for these reasons, to me the sign of a great artist. Compare this sweet, soulful cut off his debut The College Dropout: to this: If you wanna check him out, start with 2010's My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy. It's pretty much just perfect. |
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Post by jordan71421 on Jun 27, 2018 13:43:39 GMT -5
Not that I doubt any of his followers claims, but what makes Kanye West stand out from all the other hip-hop artists, speaking as someone with absolutely no idea of the subject? He's like the Radiohead of hip-hop, constantly shifting his sound, pushing boundaries, generally just being a few steps ahead of everyone else with ridiculous consistency. He's made ten studio albums including collaborations and there's not a single one of them approaching bad - like Radiohead or perhaps for you Springsteen, his albums are almost impossible to rank for these reasons, to me the sign of a great artist. Compare this sweet, soulful cut off his debut The College Dropout: to this: If you wanna check him out, start with 2010's My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy. It's pretty much just perfect. MBDTW is not the Kanye album I’d first recommend to someone to get them into him. I’d go with College Dropout or Late Registration. And of course this is all subjective, but I find Watch the Throne, Cruel Summer, and Ye to be bad albums, or at least super underwhelming with awful lyrics. |
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Post by The Escapist on Jun 27, 2018 14:00:48 GMT -5
He's like the Radiohead of hip-hop, constantly shifting his sound, pushing boundaries, generally just being a few steps ahead of everyone else with ridiculous consistency. He's made ten studio albums including collaborations and there's not a single one of them approaching bad - like Radiohead or perhaps for you Springsteen, his albums are almost impossible to rank for these reasons, to me the sign of a great artist. Compare this sweet, soulful cut off his debut The College Dropout: to this: If you wanna check him out, start with 2010's My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy. It's pretty much just perfect. MBDTW is not the Kanye album I’d first recommend to someone to get them into him. I’d go with College Dropout or Late Registration. And of course this is all subjective, but I find Watch the Throne, Cruel Summer, and Ye to be bad albums, or at least super underwhelming with awful lyrics. I think you kind of have to start with MBDTF, it's just too good not to. And Cruel Summer isn't really a Kanye album, it's a GOOD music one. Ye and Watch the Throne I guess we just disagree on, I think they're both excellent. Weaker than most of his work, no doubt, but still excellent - his Hail to the Thief/King of Limbs. |
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Post by jordan71421 on Jun 27, 2018 14:31:46 GMT -5
MBDTW is not the Kanye album I’d first recommend to someone to get them into him. I’d go with College Dropout or Late Registration. And of course this is all subjective, but I find Watch the Throne, Cruel Summer, and Ye to be bad albums, or at least super underwhelming with awful lyrics. I think you kind of have to start with MBDTF, it's just too good not to. And Cruel Summer isn't really a Kanye album, it's a GOOD music one. Ye and Watch the Throne I guess we just disagree on, I think they're both excellent. Weaker than most of his work, no doubt, but still excellent - his Hail to the Thief/King of Limbs. I think if someone were to start with MBDTF, they’d get the impression that Kanye isn’t much of a lyricist (which he isn’t, but much better than what he displays on this album.) Hell of a Life, Runaway, and So Appalled have awful lyrics imo. The production on that album is the stand out more than anything |
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Post by The Escapist on Jun 27, 2018 14:44:14 GMT -5
I think you kind of have to start with MBDTF, it's just too good not to. And Cruel Summer isn't really a Kanye album, it's a GOOD music one. Ye and Watch the Throne I guess we just disagree on, I think they're both excellent. Weaker than most of his work, no doubt, but still excellent - his Hail to the Thief/King of Limbs. I think if someone were to start with MBDTF, they’d get the impression that Kanye isn’t much of a lyricist (which he isn’t, but much better than what he displays on this album.) Hell of a Life, Runaway, and So Appalled have awful lyrics imo. The production on that album is the stand out more than anything No idea what you're on about, MBDTF is his lyrical peak. A truly perfect album. |
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Post by jordan71421 on Jun 27, 2018 17:27:35 GMT -5
I think if someone were to start with MBDTF, they’d get the impression that Kanye isn’t much of a lyricist (which he isn’t, but much better than what he displays on this album.) Hell of a Life, Runaway, and So Appalled have awful lyrics imo. The production on that album is the stand out more than anything No idea what you're on about, MBDTF is his lyrical peak. A truly perfect album. Nah not for me, it’s the start of the decline of his lyrical capabilities |
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Post by The Escapist on Jun 29, 2018 4:05:31 GMT -5
Looks like there's at least three more seven-track albums coming from Kanye, including a Chance the Rapper one!
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Post by theyknowwhatimean on Jul 1, 2018 7:23:47 GMT -5
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Post by funhouse on Jul 1, 2018 7:34:55 GMT -5
Texting "beware" to Paul McCartney and expecting a response seems like one of those dreams where you suddenly hang out with famous people. I know Damon is famous too, but maybe he had the same dream? |
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Post by The Escapist on Jul 1, 2018 8:09:05 GMT -5
The irony. Anyway, McCartney is quite noticably in all the songs he collaborated with Ye on, all of them became big hits, and Paul spoke very positively of the experience afterwards. Perhaps Albarn could call up Kanye in the hopes of making an actually memorable Gorrilaz album again? |
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Post by theyknowwhatimean on Jul 1, 2018 9:28:31 GMT -5
The irony. Anyway, McCartney is quite noticably in all the songs he collaborated with Ye on, all of them became big hits, and Paul spoke very positively of the experience afterwards. Perhaps Albarn could call up Kanye in the hopes of making an actually memorable Gorrilaz album again? Saucer of milk for the cat? What Macca said about playing guitar for Kanye and his engineer for ages, while Kanye just sat at a computer looking at pictures of his other half, did sound a bit weird though. |
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Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5