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Post by defmaybe00 on Jun 10, 2023 16:07:41 GMT -5
He should have done a three-month lead in with "I'm Not Giving Up Tonight", " Easy Now", and "We're Gonna Get there in the End" as the singles. All with proper videos and promotion. Would that get the #1? I'm not sure, but it would've made me more excited for the record while still being radio-friendly. In general, though, his solo career has lost wind since WBTM. Up until then, each album felt like it was building on the last, pushing him out further and getting more and more colourful. Since his bitter attitude in 2017, Noel has seemed a little directionless. We got uneven EPs, a Best Of, some demos, and a hodgepodge of singles. There has been good music, don't get me wrong, but that momentum which built from 2010-2017 feels like it has dissipated. Of course COVID and his personal issues have played into that, but still. For me, all this makes it the perfect time for the reunion. Give Oasis the send off it deserves, culminating at Knebworth, and then get back in the studio with Holmes to light the fire up all over again. You had me until the reunion part 😄 It looks to me the star power Noel had is waning in a big way now, and Ignition relied on that for years and now can't anymore. Foo Fighters or not this should've been an easy number one, but if you look at sales figures they're also shocking. There's nothing shocking about his sales man, it's 2023 |
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Post by Lennon2217 on Jun 10, 2023 16:24:17 GMT -5
You had me until the reunion part 😄 It looks to me the star power Noel had is waning in a big way now, and Ignition relied on that for years and now can't anymore. Foo Fighters or not this should've been an easy number one, but if you look at sales figures they're also shocking. There's nothing shocking about his sales man, it's 2023 Yeah. Nobody has big selling weeks like the old days except Taylor. |
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Post by tiger40 on Jun 10, 2023 17:19:59 GMT -5
If Noel really wanted to do some warm up gigs before his big tour begins then he should've done some here in the UK instead of beginning it in America especially with bloody Garbage a band who live up to their name.
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Post by spaneli on Jun 10, 2023 17:38:25 GMT -5
If Noel really wanted to do some warm up gigs before his big tour begins then he should've done some here in the UK instead of beginning it in America especially with bloody Garbage a band who live up to their name. Of course these gig fulfill themselves more than just being warm up gigs. Noel has done these co-headlining tours quite a bit. Mostly because they're cheaper and more efficient for him to get to tour America. His people were clearly looking for an act that would be swinging through America during the first half of whatever proposed tour and also made some thematic sense. In this case, both of them being 90s acts. He took the bite of the apple while he could because he can't skip an entire continent. I truly don't know what people don't get about this. And get this: It basically worked out. If not for FF moving in on that date, they would've had the big sales, the #1, and the cheaper American tour. That to them was worth the gamble! And you can't wholly argue with the results. They very nearly pulled it off. |
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Post by yeayeayeah on Jun 11, 2023 1:26:46 GMT -5
I've never liked the Foo Fighters with the exception of All My Life. They just sound too American trucker Rock to my ears. I think of them as more Nickleback than Nirvana.
They seem like nice chaps but I wouldn't like Oasis if personality was important to the music.
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Post by neila83 on Jun 11, 2023 5:27:26 GMT -5
If Noel really wanted to do some warm up gigs before his big tour begins then he should've done some here in the UK instead of beginning it in America especially with bloody Garbage a band who live up to their name. Of course these gig fulfill themselves more than just being warm up gigs. Noel has done these co-headlining tours quite a bit. Mostly because they're cheaper and more efficient for him to get to tour America. His people were clearly looking for an act that would be swinging through America during the first half of whatever proposed tour and also made some thematic sense. In this case, both of them being 90s acts. He took the bite of the apple while he could because he can't skip an entire continent. I truly don't know what people don't get about this. And get this: It basically worked out. If not for FF moving in on that date, they would've had the big sales, the #1, and the cheaper American tour. That to them was worth the gamble! And you can't wholly argue with the results. They very nearly pulled it off. This and what you said about his album release strategy are absolutely right. But it doesn't matter how many times it's explained, people will continue to scream that Noel should have dropped his album with a week's notice last October. I'd just add vinyl lead times as well as the other big constraint on this at the moment. In the Dave Fanning interview (very good interview by the way) Noel talks about how difficult touring has become and the economics are more difficult since the pandemic. So the Garbage offer was probably a no-brainer, otherwise they were probably having big problems making any US tour work at all. |
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Post by His Royal Noelness on Jun 11, 2023 5:47:28 GMT -5
You’d have to wonder if touring the US is even worth it anymore for him anymore. Co-headline makes it cheaper but surely reduces the income for him too.
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Post by LlAM on Jun 11, 2023 6:01:32 GMT -5
Of course these gig fulfill themselves more than just being warm up gigs. Noel has done these co-headlining tours quite a bit. Mostly because they're cheaper and more efficient for him to get to tour America. His people were clearly looking for an act that would be swinging through America during the first half of whatever proposed tour and also made some thematic sense. In this case, both of them being 90s acts. He took the bite of the apple while he could because he can't skip an entire continent. I truly don't know what people don't get about this. And get this: It basically worked out. If not for FF moving in on that date, they would've had the big sales, the #1, and the cheaper American tour. That to them was worth the gamble! And you can't wholly argue with the results. They very nearly pulled it off. This and what you said about his album release strategy are absolutely right. But it doesn't matter how many times it's explained, people will continue to scream that Noel should have dropped his album with a week's notice last October. I'd just add vinyl lead times as well as the other big constraint on this at the moment. In the Dave Fanning interview (very good interview by the way) Noel talks about how difficult touring has become and the economics are more difficult since the pandemic. So the Garbage offer was probably a no-brainer, otherwise they were probably having big problems making any US tour work at all. Yep, it was probably a better business opportunity to tour with Garbage (no pun intended, I think his album is great) than to sell 10,000-20,000 more albums in the UK in the first week if even that. I personally think his sales figures are quite decent and his management is probably satisfied too. |
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Post by neila83 on Jun 11, 2023 6:22:24 GMT -5
Skip forward to 3 minutes and the solo and you'll find another clue as to why he might have wanted to warm up outside the UK  Love the reaction of everyone after it, does seem like a really good vibe in his band. He's come along way since the first tour. |
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Post by glider on Jun 11, 2023 10:00:43 GMT -5
You had me until the reunion part 😄 It looks to me the star power Noel had is waning in a big way now, and Ignition relied on that for years and now can't anymore. Foo Fighters or not this should've been an easy number one, but if you look at sales figures they're also shocking. There's nothing shocking about his sales man, it's 2023 I'm talking in comparison to Liam last year. I know he isn't doing HFB1 numbers anytime soon. |
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Post by jeffrey on Jun 11, 2023 10:55:57 GMT -5
You’d have to wonder if touring the US is even worth it anymore for him anymore. Co-headline makes it cheaper but surely reduces the income for him too. Spot on. Same reason Liam didn’t tour the US for his last two albums. Doesn’t make sense financially. |
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Post by defmaybe00 on Jun 11, 2023 11:09:03 GMT -5
There's nothing shocking about his sales man, it's 2023 I'm talking in comparison to Liam last year. I know he isn't doing HFB1 numbers anytime soon. Still not shocking, we all know he isn't selling as much as Liam rn, plus Liam was helped (nothing wrong with that, fair play to him) by the Knebworth pre-sale, he had a big first week but then dropped out of the top 100 a month 40k these days is really good, no matter how you wanna see it |
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Post by andymorris on Jun 11, 2023 13:05:41 GMT -5
You’d have to wonder if touring the US is even worth it anymore for him anymore. Co-headline makes it cheaper but surely reduces the income for him too. Spot on. Same reason Liam didn’t tour the US for his last two albums. Doesn’t make sense financially. Depends on the deal really. I doubt Noel is losing money with garbage. They probably share crew etc so in the end he makes money. Plus he doesn’t have to pay to play other people’s songs if you know what I mean |
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Post by LlAM on Jun 11, 2023 13:42:58 GMT -5
Spot on. Same reason Liam didn’t tour the US for his last two albums. Doesn’t make sense financially. Depends on the deal really. I doubt Noel is losing money with garbage. They probably share crew etc so in the end he makes money. Plus he doesn’t have to pay to play other people’s songs if you know what I mean You never pay to play other people's songs live. |
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Post by The Invisible Sun on Jun 11, 2023 14:24:51 GMT -5
Shame the streak is over but given how bad Noel's marketing is - consistently - it's no surprise. Let's face it, the Foos were always gonna get a huge boost on this album because of what had happened with Taylor. FWIW, just put the albums out quicker, Noel. But again, that's because his management think it's the 90s. It's, ironically, probably his most 'complete' album sonically (I still think WBTM is maybe a better one but I do think CS is very good) and the one that saw his streak end. Just not understanding how people don’t see that his high sales total is causal with the long runway. The long runway is because they know it’s not the 90s anymore! Noel isn’t shifting big sales in a short span of time like he was doing when HB1 dropped. Assuming that's true, then it's time to rip the band-aid off and just accept the fact that you're not going to move huge product quickly anymore, rather than continually extend out the release time just to gather up enough sales to appear relevant.
Will there be a time when he announces an album release two or three years after it's finished being made just to pick up enough sales to make the top 10? Where's the line and at what point is it crossed into absurdity?
Frankly, I'm not sure I agree with your view because they've not really experimented with shorter release schedules, have they? Imagine releasing an album a month ahead of time and putting out 4-5 singles during that period to keep up the hype. Imagine if Noel were to get a few songs trending in the charts right up to release day. That plan wouldn't generate sales?
It's like he's not trying to draw new listeners. He's just depending on existing Oasis fans to hear that's he's putting out new material.
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Post by neila83 on Jun 11, 2023 15:23:38 GMT -5
Just not understanding how people don’t see that his high sales total is causal with the long runway. The long runway is because they know it’s not the 90s anymore! Noel isn’t shifting big sales in a short span of time like he was doing when HB1 dropped. Assuming that's true, then it's time to rip the band-aid off and just accept the fact that you're not going to move huge product quickly anymore, rather than continually extend out the release time just to gather up enough sales to appear relevant.
Will there be a time when he announces an album release two or three years after it's finished being made just to pick up enough sales to make the top 10? Where's the line and at what point is it crossed into absurdity? Frankly, I'm not sure I agree with your view because they've not really experimented with shorter release schedules, have they? Imagine releasing an album a month ahead of time and putting out 4-5 singles during that period to keep up the hype. Imagine if Noel were to get a few songs trending in the charts right up to release day. That plan wouldn't generate sales?
It's like he's not trying to draw new listeners. He's just depending on existing Oasis fans to hear that's he's putting out new material.
Noel isn't going to get a few songs trending in the charts up to release day. It's not just his management who need to realise it's not the 90s, people here do too. This idea if he just did things a bit differently he'd smash the charts is delusional, he does well to get as much publicity as he does at this stage in his career. He can't just put out 4-5 singles in a month, he needs people to play them and promote him. Radio won't give him that time 4 times in one month. People seem to think Noel can just snap his fingers ands the world will do as he bids. It doesn't work like that. He's not a radio 1 artist. |
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Post by NY on Jun 11, 2023 15:29:37 GMT -5
. He's not a radio 1 artist. Thank fuck for that. |
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Post by tomlivesforever on Jun 11, 2023 16:05:20 GMT -5
He’s a bloke in his mid 50’s still capable of putting out albums of a decent standard.
Fuck the charts. The people that want to buy the record will and the people that want go and see him will. The only thing that matters is quality.
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Post by The Invisible Sun on Jun 11, 2023 16:05:48 GMT -5
Assuming that's true, then it's time to rip the band-aid off and just accept the fact that you're not going to move huge product quickly anymore, rather than continually extend out the release time just to gather up enough sales to appear relevant.
Will there be a time when he announces an album release two or three years after it's finished being made just to pick up enough sales to make the top 10? Where's the line and at what point is it crossed into absurdity? Frankly, I'm not sure I agree with your view because they've not really experimented with shorter release schedules, have they? Imagine releasing an album a month ahead of time and putting out 4-5 singles during that period to keep up the hype. Imagine if Noel were to get a few songs trending in the charts right up to release day. That plan wouldn't generate sales?
It's like he's not trying to draw new listeners. He's just depending on existing Oasis fans to hear that's he's putting out new material.
Noel isn't going to get a few songs trending in the charts up to release day. It's not just his management who need to realise it's not the 90s, people here do too. This idea if he just did things a bit differently he'd smash the charts is delusional, he does well to get as much publicity as he does at this stage in his career. He can't just put out 4-5 singles in a month, he needs people to play them and promote him. Radio won't give him that time 4 times in one month. People seem to think Noel can just snap his fingers ands the world will do as he bids. It doesn't work like that. He's not a radio 1 artist. How do you know? It's not been done by Noel, right? We live in the world of streaming now. Radio is still relevant but it's objectively less relevant than streaming. Noel can put out 4-5 singles in a month. And I think it would do significantly better than allowing any hype surrounding each single release to die off. Compound on that hype. Use Youtube reviewers to promote the singles. Use Tiktokers. Use people with mass media influence to push the content, especially to younger listeners.
Note that the talk show spots and radio and interviews and press releases, and whatever else they have planned would all still happen just as it does now. It just wouldn't be spread thinly over 6+ months. They'd plan it all ahead of time. No Thanos snap needed. Noel doesn't need to be on the radio for every new single. Maybe for one or two in that month period is all he needs to appeal to that demographic. And if he has a radio hit, they'll bring him on even if it wasn't planned ahead, right? Because they want to capitalize on hype too.
I mean, the hardcore base here went effectively silent between single releases. Threads were filled with complaints about the length of this cycle, rather than interesting discussions of the music made. And even with the long cycle, Noel's sales aren't impressive. If even the hardcore base can't be invigorated to remain hyped for a period of months, it makes zero sense to continue this elongated release strategy.
The world has changed. We live in the world of TikTok and short attention spans. That's why I am advocating for a shorter, but condensed release cycle that gets Noel's name out there basically daily to gather attention and sales from old and new listeners alike.
Isn't it at least worth a shot to figure out if it works for him? He's already lost his winning streak ... maybe now he has nothing to lose ...
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Post by Lennon2217 on Jun 11, 2023 16:20:30 GMT -5
I think people might be a little shocked if older artists like Noel and Liam didn’t rack up several months of pre sales (which is also a way of gaming the system) and just did a 5-6 week lead up. They might crack Top 5-10 range. If they run up against a bigger artists they’d get waxed. If see nothing wrong with that they are doing. Who really cares? Liam and Noel going #1 doesn’t make me rich or glamorous. It’s just a talking point. As long as the music is good is all that matters.
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2023 17:13:24 GMT -5
Shame the streak is over but given how bad Noel's marketing is - consistently - it's no surprise. Let's face it, the Foos were always gonna get a huge boost on this album because of what had happened with Taylor. FWIW, just put the albums out quicker, Noel. But again, that's because his management think it's the 90s. It's, ironically, probably his most 'complete' album sonically (I still think WBTM is maybe a better one but I do think CS is very good) and the one that saw his streak end. Just not understanding how people don’t see that his high sales total is causal with the long runway. The long runway is because they know it’s not the 90s anymore! Noel isn’t shifting big sales in a short span of time like he was doing when HB1 dropped. Granted, but didnt' Foos get that runway in 2-3 months? I get it, albums now do have that long run up, and I'm not saying drop it in 2 weeks or anything. But WBTM, for example, was confirmed in early October and released in late November. So perhaps a balance between 6 months and that? |
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2023 17:15:16 GMT -5
Just not understanding how people don’t see that his high sales total is causal with the long runway. The long runway is because they know it’s not the 90s anymore! Noel isn’t shifting big sales in a short span of time like he was doing when HB1 dropped. Assuming that's true, then it's time to rip the band-aid off and just accept the fact that you're not going to move huge product quickly anymore, rather than continually extend out the release time just to gather up enough sales to appear relevant.
Will there be a time when he announces an album release two or three years after it's finished being made just to pick up enough sales to make the top 10? Where's the line and at what point is it crossed into absurdity?
Frankly, I'm not sure I agree with your view because they've not really experimented with shorter release schedules, have they? Imagine releasing an album a month ahead of time and putting out 4-5 singles during that period to keep up the hype. Imagine if Noel were to get a few songs trending in the charts right up to release day. That plan wouldn't generate sales?
It's like he's not trying to draw new listeners. He's just depending on existing Oasis fans to hear that's he's putting out new material.
Moon, which sold what, over 70k copies in the first week (and I understand 2017 is a long while ago) was confirmed and then released in less than 2 months, IIRC it was about 7-8 weeks from Holy Mountain dropping and then the actual album coming out, but maybe a bit longer from when the 'trailer' dropped. It wasn't much though. |
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2023 17:17:41 GMT -5
I think people might be a little shocked if older artists like Noel and Liam didn’t rack up several months of pre sales (which is also a way of gaming the system) and just did a 5-6 week lead up. They might crack Top 5-10 range. If they run up against a bigger artists they’d get waxed. If see nothing wrong with that they are doing. Who really cares? Liam and Noel going #1 doesn’t make me rich or glamorous. It’s just a talking point. As long as the music is good is all that matters. The Gallaghers will always have a shot at UK1 on name alone, mate. That's the thing. And in any other year where the Foos weren't releasing this album after what had happened, then NG probably would have still edged it. Not that I begrude the Foos doing that btw or that it matters at all in the grand scheme of things. There's definitely a balance to be struck. But yeah, the music from both, generally, has been excellent in the last few years. |
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Post by spaneli on Jun 11, 2023 17:19:02 GMT -5
Assuming that's true, then it's time to rip the band-aid off and just accept the fact that you're not going to move huge product quickly anymore, rather than continually extend out the release time just to gather up enough sales to appear relevant.
Will there be a time when he announces an album release two or three years after it's finished being made just to pick up enough sales to make the top 10? Where's the line and at what point is it crossed into absurdity? Frankly, I'm not sure I agree with your view because they've not really experimented with shorter release schedules, have they? Imagine releasing an album a month ahead of time and putting out 4-5 singles during that period to keep up the hype. Imagine if Noel were to get a few songs trending in the charts right up to release day. That plan wouldn't generate sales?
It's like he's not trying to draw new listeners. He's just depending on existing Oasis fans to hear that's he's putting out new material.
Moon, which sold what, over 70k copies in the first week (and I understand 2017 is a long while ago) was confirmed and then released in less than 2 months, IIRC it was about 7-8 weeks from Holy Mountain dropping and then the actual album coming out, but maybe a bit longer from when the 'trailer' dropped. It wasn't much though. Man, I wonder what happened during that time that cataclysmically altered the entire world and just about every industry. It basically renders every thing you're saying after that parenetical moot. |
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Post by bt95 on Jun 11, 2023 17:26:58 GMT -5
Moon, which sold what, over 70k copies in the first week (and I understand 2017 is a long while ago) was confirmed and then released in less than 2 months, IIRC it was about 7-8 weeks from Holy Mountain dropping and then the actual album coming out, but maybe a bit longer from when the 'trailer' dropped. It wasn't much though. Man, I wonder what happened during that time that cataclysmically altered the entire world and just about every industry. It basically renders every thing you're saying after that parenetical moot. The Foo Fighters announced their new album in April. www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/foo-fighters-new-album-but-here-we-are-first-single-rescued-1234717612/There's really no need to be so dismissive of it or treat me like I'm thick, my friend. I am aware Noel, and Liam and other artists around their age/of the genre, are very reliant on vinyl production too, etc. So again, I get it. I just think there was probably a balance between releasing the first single in October and not releasing the album until June. It's annoying that this is how the industry is, and it obviously impacts other, 'contemporary' acts too (I'm a huge DMA's fan and they released a lead single in August and the album wasn't out until March). It doesn't mean there can't possibly be a balance between the two extremes either. PS. In regards to what you quoted, I was merely saying to the OP that yes, NG's team had tried a 'quick' drop before, and it was for the last album cycle. The one before that was when they did the 5-month build up for CY. |
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Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5