Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2015 13:36:37 GMT -5
This is the kind of stuf they should have been making. Hypnotic drum loops, guitar avalanches and shoegaze riffs all completed with brilliant, dark lyrics. Fresh, powerful and exhilarating. What we got however...
|
|
|
Post by Lennon2217 on Sept 26, 2015 13:39:02 GMT -5
This is the kind of stuf they should have been making. Hypnotic drum loops, guitar avalanches and shoegaze riffs all completed with brilliant, dark lyrics. Fresh, powerful and exhilarating. What we got however... It definitely sounds forward thinking and a continuation of sounds explored/hinted at with SOTSOG. Tighten up some lyrics, get Liam's vocals on there and bam.......one hell of a single. Loud and in fucking charge!
|
|
|
Post by Beady’s Here Now on Sept 26, 2015 15:42:33 GMT -5
This is the kind of stuf they should have been making. Hypnotic drum loops, guitar avalanches and shoegaze riffs all completed with brilliant, dark lyrics. Fresh, powerful and exhilarating. What we got however... As I said....One thing summed up Oasis' HC Era: The decision to not use THT's demo as the released version. The demo was loud, ambitious, different, and infectious whereas the album version was safe, generic, and bland....
|
|
|
Post by World71R on Sept 26, 2015 19:43:28 GMT -5
This is the kind of stuf they should have been making. Hypnotic drum loops, guitar avalanches and shoegaze riffs all completed with brilliant, dark lyrics. Fresh, powerful and exhilarating. What we got however... It definitely sounds forward thinking and a continuation of sounds explored/hinted at with SOTSOG. Tighten up some lyrics, get Liam's vocals on there and bam.......one hell of a single. Loud and in fucking charge! Hell, even Liam liked it, as shown by his reaction to it being played on the tour bus, which was from the Tour of Brotherly Love documentary they made. It feels slow, but the loud guitars and driving drum loop carry it along seriously well.
|
|
|
Post by mystoryisgory on Sept 26, 2015 20:38:35 GMT -5
It definitely sounds forward thinking and a continuation of sounds explored/hinted at with SOTSOG. Tighten up some lyrics, get Liam's vocals on there and bam.......one hell of a single. Loud and in fucking charge! Hell, even Liam liked it, as shown by his reaction to it being played on the tour bus, which was from the Tour of Brotherly Love documentary they made. It feels slow, but the loud guitars and driving drum loop carry it along seriously well. The lyrics are also a LOT better than the album version.
|
|
|
Post by World71R on Sept 26, 2015 20:44:52 GMT -5
Hell, even Liam liked it, as shown by his reaction to it being played on the tour bus, which was from the Tour of Brotherly Love documentary they made. It feels slow, but the loud guitars and driving drum loop carry it along seriously well. The lyrics are also a LOT better than the album version. Completely agree. Whenever I think of The Hindu Times, I think of the intro, and then when Liam comes in, I think of the lyrics "You fall in, you fall down. There's no love, in your shotgun town". Obviously Liam didn't sing those lines, but in my mind, he sang it out brilliantly, over the top of the album version's backing track, just with the demo drum loop mixed in.
|
|
|
Post by The Crimson Rambler on Sept 27, 2015 12:28:31 GMT -5
The Hindu Times [Demo] really shows the potential this song had and as far as I'm concerned it should have been a stepping stone onto an even bigger and better sound. With the right producer and a respectable amount of ambition it could have sounded colossal. The fact that the skeleton of the track is built on this repetitive driving drone, it should have given them almost free rein to play and build on it with some ease. And texture would have played a huge, huge part in it. I actually think Noel does a really good job vocally on the demo but you'd think Liam's thick vocal performance would be the perfect match. The final product we got still stands as a personal highlight of sorts, however it could have much, much more. Oh, well.
|
|
|
Post by guigsysEstring on Sept 27, 2015 13:50:53 GMT -5
The Hindu Times [Demo] really shows the potential this song had and as far as I'm concerned it should have been a stepping stone onto an even bigger and better sound. With the right producer and a respectable amount of ambition it could have sounded colossal. The fact that the skeleton of the track is built on this repetitive driving drone, it should have given them almost free rein to play and build on it with some ease. And texture would have played a huge, huge part in it. I actually think Noel does a really good job vocally on the demo but you'd think Liam's thick vocal performance would be the perfect match. The final product we got still stands as a personal highlight of sorts, however it could have much, much more. Oh, well. Agree with that post except for me the Album version could easily have been a Stereophonics tune, and I don't just mean the same sized feet riff. That demo could have shown them the way to build not only that song but the entire HC album, but again, more poor choices quelle surprise from Oasis
|
|
|
Post by Headmaster on Sept 27, 2015 13:54:55 GMT -5
It definitely sounds forward thinking and a continuation of sounds explored/hinted at with SOTSOG. Tighten up some lyrics, get Liam's vocals on there and bam.......one hell of a single. Loud and in fucking charge! Hell, even Liam liked it, as shown by his reaction to it being played on the tour bus, which was from the Tour of Brotherly Love documentary they made. It feels slow, but the loud guitars and driving drum loop carry it along seriously well. But also you can see that, on the same footage, while Liam was having a blast with the demo, Noel seems uncomfortable with it.
|
|
|
Post by guigsysEstring on Sept 27, 2015 14:01:43 GMT -5
Hell, even Liam liked it, as shown by his reaction to it being played on the tour bus, which was from the Tour of Brotherly Love documentary they made. It feels slow, but the loud guitars and driving drum loop carry it along seriously well. But also you can see that, on the same footage, while Liam was having a blast with the demo, Noel seems uncomfortable with it. Yes unfortunately during even by his own standards Noel's ultra Luddite phase, perhaps understandably given the reaction they had critically and commercially with SOTSOG. The tour with The Black Crowes had gone down well by and large, so perhaps the thinking was to strip back and be a straight forward rock n' roll band once more. Unfortunately as has been said before production, track listings etc. were not up to it....
|
|
|
Post by Headmaster on Sept 27, 2015 16:38:56 GMT -5
But also you can see that, on the same footage, while Liam was having a blast with the demo, Noel seems uncomfortable with it. Yes unfortunately during even by his own standards Noel's ultra Luddite phase, perhaps understandably given the reaction they had critically and commercially with SOTSOG. The tour with The Black Crowes had gone down well by and large, so perhaps the thinking was to strip back and be a straight forward rock n' roll band once more. Unfortunately as has been said before production, track listings etc. were not up to it.... I think Noel looked at what was going on on the rock scene at the time, with bands like White Stripes, Strokes, Libertines, Vines, Hives..., all more straight rock based sound, so Noel wanted to go in this direction too I guess, and also given the bad reception SOTSOG got.
|
|
|
Post by Manualex on Sept 27, 2015 16:51:27 GMT -5
Yes unfortunately during even by his own standards Noel's ultra Luddite phase, perhaps understandably given the reaction they had critically and commercially with SOTSOG. The tour with The Black Crowes had gone down well by and large, so perhaps the thinking was to strip back and be a straight forward rock n' roll band once more. Unfortunately as has been said before production, track listings etc. were not up to it.... I think Noel looked at what was going on on the rock scene at the time, with bands like White Stripes, Strokes, Libertines, Vines, Hives..., all more straight rock based sound, so Noel wanted to go in this direction too I guess, and also given the bad reception SOTSOG got. All those bands released great works with their 2001/2002 albums but HC feels lifeless, tired and sterile at times.
|
|
|
Post by Mean Mrs. Mustard on Sept 27, 2015 16:52:44 GMT -5
I think Noel looked at what was going on on the rock scene at the time, with bands like White Stripes, Strokes, Libertines, Vines, Hives..., all more straight rock based sound, so Noel wanted to go in this direction too I guess, and also given the bad reception SOTSOG got. All those bands released great works with their 2001/2002 albums but HC feels lifeless, tired and sterile at times. That's because it was probably a bit forced.
|
|
|
Post by Lennon2217 on Sept 27, 2015 20:39:17 GMT -5
I wonder why Noel got cold feet with that demo. I've never meet an Oasis fan who didn't FUCKING love that song.
|
|
|
Post by The Crimson Rambler on Sept 27, 2015 20:47:57 GMT -5
I wonder why Noel got cold feet with that demo. I've never meet an Oasis fan who didn't FUCKING love that song. I blame Gem...
|
|
|
Post by batfink30 on Sept 27, 2015 20:49:34 GMT -5
I wonder why Noel got cold feet with that demo. I've never meet an Oasis fan who didn't FUCKING love that song. It's a great demo,no doubt. Full of anger and passion. The final produced version is bland shit.
|
|
|
Post by guigsysEstring on Sept 27, 2015 20:53:06 GMT -5
I wonder why Noel got cold feet with that demo. I've never meet an Oasis fan who didn't FUCKING love that song. I'd go with what I've said before, he was stung by criticism from the SOTSOG reviews and as others have said, possibly noted the rise of the new wave garage bands which ended with Jet selling 3.5 million copies of an enjoyable but musical cul-de-sac album in 'Get Born'. I said before as well that the tour with The Black Crowes was well received, although it didn't increase US sales for Oasis, and so that probably played a part too in regressing from modern methods. I love the Crowes but if you are trying to convince someone to move forward in sound and style then they really aren't the band to be holding up as an example! The upshot of that was ditching all the forward thinking ideas and techniques introduced by Mark 'Spike' Stent in favour of a back to basic approach in not only production but also the structuring of songs themselves, with no room for any innovation. I think if I remember rightly this was around the time of The Last Party and a few other documentary pieces where Noel talks about keeping it straight forward and words to that effect, which was a dramatic shift from the words of 18 months to two years prior. A shame it went that way as I think the follow up to a Spike Stent style Heathen Chemistry would have been very different to what we now know as DBTT. It may or may not have sold as well, but sonically it could have completed a spectacular departure from the Oasis sound that was recycled for a decade or so.
|
|
|
Post by mahsteve on Sept 28, 2015 2:04:26 GMT -5
I wonder why Noel got cold feet with that demo. I've never meet an Oasis fan who didn't FUCKING love that song. I'd go with what I've said before, he was stung by criticism from the SOTSOG reviews and as others have said, possibly noted the rise of the new wave garage bands which ended with Jet selling 3.5 million copies of an enjoyable but musical cul-de-sac album in 'Get Born'. I said before as well that the tour with The Black Crowes was well received, although it didn't increase US sales for Oasis, and so that probably played a part too in regressing from modern methods. I love the Crowes but if you are trying to convince someone to move forward in sound and style then they really aren't the band to be holding up as an example! The upshot of that was ditching all the forward thinking ideas and techniques introduced by Mark 'Spike' Stent in favour of a back to basic approach in not only production but also the structuring of songs themselves, with no room for any innovation. I think if I remember rightly this was around the time of The Last Party and a few other documentary pieces where Noel talks about keeping it straight forward and words to that effect, which was a dramatic shift from the words of 18 months to two years prior. A shame it went that way as I think the follow up to a Spike Stent style Heathen Chemistry would have been very different to what we now know as DBTT. It may or may not have sold as well, but sonically it could have completed a spectacular departure from the Oasis sound that was recycled for a decade or so. Interesting stuff as always. For the record can I just say yes HC isn't a great album and could be so much better but it's not the worst album ever. It is a missed opportunity which sadly is a reoccurring theme with the band :-(
|
|
|
Post by Lennon2217 on Sept 28, 2015 6:07:39 GMT -5
What sells more copies as a reissue?
- SOTSOG
- Heathen Chemistry
- Dig Out Your Soul
* Leaving DBTT out. Some fans have a crazy attachment to that LP.
|
|
|
Post by beentherenow on Sept 28, 2015 6:25:47 GMT -5
I love to say that I think HC was a result of Noel noticing the emergence of the more stripped back sound of The Strokes and White Stripes etc but a) I think that is giving Noel far too much credit b) if this was his attempt of keeping up with the new musical trend, he couldn't have gotten it more wrong,
I was 16 when Heathen Chemistry was released and I was almost embarrassed to say I liked Oasis at that time. 2001-03 was such as good era for new bands, the two I've mentioned, The Vines, Datsun's, Music, KOL, TCTC etc and I loved it all. I was constantly going to tiny music venues to see awesome new bands but my love for Oasis was still there. When conversations about music came about, I may as well have been talking about a secret love for Phil Collins whenever I mentioned Oasis. That is how uncool Oasis and HC was in comparison. They were not relevant in anyway, shape or form.
I'd listen to Highly Evolved or White Blood Cells and then take one look at HC's dull cover and see She is Love, PAITM, Better Man etc and just sigh at how shit it was.
|
|
|
Post by Mean Mrs. Mustard on Sept 28, 2015 11:11:37 GMT -5
What sells more copies as a reissue? - SOTSOG - Heathen Chemistry - Dig Out Your Soul * Leaving DBTT out. Some fans have a crazy attachment to that LP. Unfortunately, probably HC. DOYS is still "too new" and SOTSOG didn't sell a lot and didn't have any huge hits. HC is the album that sold the most out of those three, and which had the biggest hits out of those three, sad but true. It was a succesful time for the band. Also, the songs on that album would benefit the most from being re-mixed (or rather, re-written, ahum) All three era's must have some interesting material in the vaults though.
|
|
|
Post by javitorres86 on Sept 28, 2015 12:20:59 GMT -5
What sells more copies as a reissue? - SOTSOG - Heathen Chemistry - Dig Out Your Soul * Leaving DBTT out. Some fans have a crazy attachment to that LP. Unfortunately, probably HC. DOYS is still "too new" and SOTSOG didn't sell a lot and didn't have any huge hits. HC is the album that sold the most out of those three, and which had the biggest hits out of those three, sad but true. It was a succesful time for the band. Also, the songs on that album would benefit the most from being re-mixed (or rather, re-written, ahum) All three era's must have some interesting material in the vaults though. +100.000.000
|
|
|
Post by beentherenow on Sept 28, 2015 12:39:09 GMT -5
What sells more copies as a reissue? - SOTSOG - Heathen Chemistry - Dig Out Your Soul * Leaving DBTT out. Some fans have a crazy attachment to that LP. It's SOTSOG IMO Whilst HC outsold it originally, who is buying these reissues? It certainly isn't the fair weather fans who got swayed by SCYHO. It is us sad lot still discussing a defunct band. What are people on here likely to buy? Judging by this thread people aren't exactly chomping at the bit to listen to (Probably) All in the Mind and Better Man again Also think if the wealth of material which was around the SOTSOG era. A disk of properly produced SOTSOG demos would be a thing a beauty. Apart from THT demo HC doesn't have anywhere near the stuff that I know of to entice people to listen to that dirge again Whilst HC is the album most in need of a production make over, that isn't going to happen judging by the MG and DM reissues and besides you can't polish a turd.
|
|
|
Post by Mean Mrs. Mustard on Sept 28, 2015 12:54:13 GMT -5
^ Good points as well.
IMO these reissues have been completely unnecessary. I'd much rather have some sort of anthology set.
|
|
|
Post by The Crimson Rambler on Sept 28, 2015 13:37:50 GMT -5
I wonder why Noel got cold feet with that demo. I've never meet an Oasis fan who didn't FUCKING love that song. I blame Gem... Even more specifically:
|
|