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Post by Headmaster on Aug 6, 2015 18:16:26 GMT -5
Alan did a fantastic job on MG which has the best drumming on an Oasis album, on BHN he struggled a bit on the rawer songs, on SOTSOG he was ok, and on HC his work was poor, but also it was mixed too low.
Zak's drumming was a bit generic, hitting harder doesn't make you a better drummer, but overall his works with the band were good but nothing as mindblowing as Alan on Wonderwall, but he did some great stuffs on DOYS.
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Post by guigsysEstring on Aug 6, 2015 18:40:09 GMT -5
Alan did a fantastic job on MG which has the best drumming on an Oasis album, on BHN he struggled a bit on the rawer songs, on SOTSOG he was ok, and on HC his work was poor, but also it was mixed too low. Zak's drumming was a bit generic, hitting harder doesn't make you a better drummer, but overall his works with the band were good but nothing as mindblowing as Alan on Wonderwall, but he did some great stuffs on DOYS. I Think his work on BHN struggled because the arrangements weren't there, and everybody was off their heads at the time- band, management and producer had no real input in quality control. I thought on HC he was the only one who didn't put a foot wrong in fairness, although I agree he is mixed very low. |
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Post by Manualex on Aug 6, 2015 18:51:51 GMT -5
Alan was perfectly competent drumming for the band, but he never did anything stand out. Very average. Despite some flaws live, Zak was my favourite. He was great all over Dig Out Your Soul and helped give a very straightforward band a touch of originality. Cast No Shadow and Wonderwall wouldn't be the kind of songs they are without the drumming of Alan White. I didn't liked the versions Zak and Chris later did on wonderwall. |
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Post by glider on Aug 6, 2015 19:30:34 GMT -5
Alan was perfectly competent drumming for the band, but he never did anything stand out. Very average. Despite some flaws live, Zak was my favourite. He was great all over Dig Out Your Soul and helped give a very straightforward band a touch of originality. Cast No Shadow and Wonderwall wouldn't be the kind of songs they are without the drumming of Alan White. I didn't liked the versions Zak and Chris later did on wonderwall. Very important post you've made, because it highlights that there was a need for different drummers in the different eras for the band. White did great on alot of DM tunes, but there's a reason they (please correct me if I'm wrong) never played Bring it On Down live after 1995. Tony's drumming, while very simple, gave that song the brash and intense focus it needed, and it was something Zak Starkey couldn't duplicate. Example below: Alan White's drumming was very integral to Morning Glory, Cast No Shadow, Hello, Don't Look Back in Anger, Wonderwall, and many of the era's b-sides. Chris did a great job at being consistent and even outdoing DBTT and DOYS era drumming (he nails the 'Shock' solo live). Yet those key eras (DM and WTSMG) saw two drummers that were so crucial to that style, which was very hard to keep consistent with Zak and Chris. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 6, 2015 20:39:46 GMT -5
I don't know why but Tony will always be my favorite Oasis drummer. I think because he was the original drummer. Alan was great on Morning Glory but I didn't like him since I saw FTM.
Tony
Chris, Zak, Alan
(Tony wasn't their best but was vert important for the sound of Definitely Maybe)
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Post by sgtpeppr on Aug 6, 2015 23:05:37 GMT -5
not being brilliant doesnt mean your shit. he was good enough. and better than 'whatshisname'...
noel shouldve played drums on the albums.
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Post by tomlivesforever on Aug 7, 2015 1:58:50 GMT -5
come on mate, sharrock was far better for the Oasis sound Nah sorry - when I listen to songs like Wonderwall and Cast No Shadow, I haven't heard better drumming from any of the drummers. Personally think all the other drummers would have destroyed those recordings by banging the drums like that gorilla from the Cadbury adverts. Subtlety isn't really a thing Oasis were ever good at (or bothered trying), but with Alan White on drums, they certainly sounded a lot more sophisticated. Can't agree with that. Both his brother and Sharrock have a really good range of drumming. Alan did a good job on WTSMG but live he was a bit pony. His brother improved almost every song from the Brotherly Love Tour and Sharrock did songs like Rock n Roll star about as well as they can be. |
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Post by rekrelf on Aug 7, 2015 2:09:30 GMT -5
He was the best Oasis drummer!!! He had for me the real Oasis flow. Alan was such a fucking good drummer and made a big part of the Be here now sound (which is my favourite record).
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Post by thomuk2006 on Aug 7, 2015 2:54:50 GMT -5
Cast No Shadow and Wonderwall wouldn't be the kind of songs they are without the drumming of Alan White. I didn't liked the versions Zak and Chris later did on wonderwall. Very important post you've made, because it highlights that there was a need for different drummers in the different eras for the band. White did great on alot of DM tunes, but there's a reason they (please correct me if I'm wrong) never played Bring it On Down live after 1995. Tony's drumming, while very simple, gave that song the brash and intense focus it needed, and it was something Zak Starkey couldn't duplicate. Example below: Alan White's drumming was very integral to Morning Glory, Cast No Shadow, Hello, Don't Look Back in Anger, Wonderwall, and many of the era's b-sides. Chris did a great job at being consistent and even outdoing DBTT and DOYS era drumming (he nails the 'Shock' solo live). Yet those key eras (DM and WTSMG) saw two drummers that were so crucial to that style, which was very hard to keep consistent with Zak and Chris. Awful drumming by Zak on that video! far to fucking loose.. really terrible... he is was great in the studio, but shit live. Alan was great in the studio and great live! End of topic. |
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Post by beentherenow on Aug 7, 2015 3:15:01 GMT -5
Alan was technically the best musician Oasis ever had, his timing and technique were sublime,
Ok he wasn't as powerful as some but if Noel needed a drum fill or had something in his head Alan could interpret and execute it better than anyone,
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Post by standbymoi on Aug 7, 2015 6:32:32 GMT -5
Liam, noel and Whitey were Oasis. The day I turned the tv on to watch the Glastonbury coverage of them in 2004 it was all over for me.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2015 6:39:24 GMT -5
Liam, noel and Whitey were Oasis. The day I turned the tv on to watch the Glastonbury coverage of them in 2004 it was all over for me. I can't agree with that man ......liam and noelARE AND WILL ALWAYS BE OASIS ...........IF NOEL AND LIAM REUNITED TODAY WITH NO WHITEY .......NOBODY WOULD CARE OR EVEN REALIZE HE WAS GONE .....THE DRUMMING IN OASIS IS NOT THAT HUGE ITS GOOD FILL THEY COULD EASILY MOVE AHEAD WITH NO WHITEY ......if they reunited right now with a session drummer , nobody would care and it would still BE OASIS. but no liam no noel.  ? NO OASIS. THAT IS THE DIFFETENCE |
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Post by standbymoi on Aug 7, 2015 8:46:54 GMT -5
Liam, noel and Whitey were Oasis. The day I turned the tv on to watch the Glastonbury coverage of them in 2004 it was all over for me. I can't agree with that man ......liam and noelARE AND WILL ALWAYS BE OASIS ...........IF NOEL AND LIAM REUNITED TODAY WITH NO WHITEY .......NOBODY WOULD CARE OR EVEN REALIZE HE WAS GONE .....THE DRUMMING IN OASIS IS NOT THAT HUGE ITS GOOD FILL THEY COULD EASILY MOVE AHEAD WITH NO WHITEY ......if they reunited right now with a session drummer , nobody would care and it would still BE OASIS. but no liam no noel. ? NO OASIS. THAT IS THE DIFFETENCE I totally agree with you. I just meant for ME personally that was MY most fanatic oasis period. Of course Liam and Noel are what it's all about to the public, obviously. |
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Post by globe on Aug 7, 2015 8:49:12 GMT -5
Liam, noel and Whitey were Oasis. The day I turned the tv on to watch the Glastonbury coverage of them in 2004 it was all over for me. Yep watching Zak bashing his way through all those great songs was pretty depressing that night. |
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Post by standbymoi on Aug 7, 2015 9:07:43 GMT -5
Liam, noel and Whitey were Oasis. The day I turned the tv on to watch the Glastonbury coverage of them in 2004 it was all over for me. Yep watching Zak bashing his way through all those great songs was pretty depressing that night. Yeah that and Noel's new microphone stand position with him hunched over looking miserable. |
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Post by The Crimson Rambler on Aug 7, 2015 10:12:22 GMT -5
Damn. Some of you guys really rate Whitey. Less than 2 full pages in and "Spectacular", "Mindblowing", "Phenomenal" & "Sublime" have all shown their faces. Either your Oasis-nostalgia is peaking into wild exaggeration territory or some people are lacking some much needed perspective. Do you think other bands fans would be jumping for joy if he joined them? Almost certainly not. If Alan played for a different band would Oasis fans even note his existence? I highly doubt it. In the wider music community he's nothing more than an average, competent drummer.
Apart from a few fleeting flashes in the wider Oasis discography, the drumming on Dig Out Your Soul really stands out in my opinion and upon first listen was the element which immediately struck me as breaking away from the Oasis of old. A band which has been (quite rightly) accused of being backward facing, unoriginal, uninventive, unambitious and forever playing it so so safe. Zak did a really great job of improving an element of the band whose goal has always strived for being nothing more than passable. He may have pulled some questionable moves live but when it came down to adding to Noel's songwriting, no one added more variety in such a short space of time.
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Post by guigsysEstring on Aug 7, 2015 10:16:05 GMT -5
Liam, noel and Whitey were Oasis. The day I turned the tv on to watch the Glastonbury coverage of them in 2004 it was all over for me. I can't agree with that man ......liam and noelARE AND WILL ALWAYS BE OASIS ...........IF NOEL AND LIAM REUNITED TODAY WITH NO WHITEY .......NOBODY WOULD CARE OR EVEN REALIZE HE WAS GONE .....THE DRUMMING IN OASIS IS NOT THAT HUGE ITS GOOD FILL THEY COULD EASILY MOVE AHEAD WITH NO WHITEY ......if they reunited right now with a session drummer , nobody would care and it would still BE OASIS. but no liam no noel. ? NO OASIS. THAT IS THE DIFFETENCE I see where you're coming from Kalas but if they did reunite today then whether it was for a new album & long term, or simply a rehash of the glory days (94-98) then you would want the best possible line up. Alan White on drums was easily the most versatile drummer they had, even if perhaps not the most out and out Rock n' Roll. I take your point no one would care who the other musicians were (at least to begin with) but (slightly off topic) if having the right line up meant the difference between a well received comeback or being seen as a failed cash in attempt, I would definitely go with Alan Whit, Bonehead and Guigs for a "Best Of" touring the first three records. Reuniting the band for new material and subsequent tours is a different matter, as you say then all you would need is Noel and Liam, who could look at musicians they have either worked with in Oasis, solo in Noel's case or even new people who bring something new to the lineup. That said like most things I go on about it's hypothetical, but it keeps me thinking!  |
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Post by guigsysEstring on Aug 7, 2015 10:24:21 GMT -5
Damn. Some of you guys really rate Whitey. Less than 2 full pages in and " Spectacular", " Mindblowing", " Phenomenal" & " Sublime" have all shown their faces. Either your Oasis-nostalgia is peaking into wild exaggeration territory or some people are lacking some much needed perspective. Do you think other bands fans would be jumping for joy if he joined them? Almost certainly not. If Alan played for a different band would Oasis fans even note his existence? I highly doubt it. In the wider music community he's nothing more than an average, competent drummer. Apart from a few fleeting flashes in the wider Oasis discography, the drumming on Dig Out Your Soul really stands out in my opinion and upon first listen was the element which immediately struck me as breaking away from the Oasis of old. A band which has been (quite rightly) accused of being backward facing, unoriginal, uninventive, unambitious and forever playing it so so safe. Zak did a really great job of improving an element of the band whose goal has always strived for being nothing more than passable. He may have pulled some questionable moves live but when it came down to adding to Noel's songwriting, no one added more variety in such a short space of time. It probably is a case of nostalgia for some, I happen to genuinely rate Whitey, but then onto Zak I have to disagree slightly, at least. He to my mind at least, also fits into the competent drummer range. He also played with alot of artists either backward facing or living on past glories, and unfortunately caught Oasis at the tail end of their career. I have to wonder how far in the business he would have got if he had been Zak from Surrey, as opposed to Ringo Starr's son. I know you could same the same about Alan White re: his brother Steve but it depends if you believe Steve or not when he claims Noel never asked him or Weller about Alan, he just heard him playing in an adjacent studio with Idha Bell, Andy's ex wife who at the time was a Creation Records artist while Bell was still in a rapidly disintegrating Ride. |
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Post by matt on Aug 7, 2015 10:38:59 GMT -5
Damn. Some of you guys really rate Whitey. Less than 2 full pages in and " Spectacular", " Mindblowing", " Phenomenal" & " Sublime" have all shown their faces. Either your Oasis-nostalgia is peaking into wild exaggeration territory or some people are lacking some much needed perspective. Do you think other bands fans would be jumping for joy if he joined them? Almost certainly not. If Alan played for a different band would Oasis fans even note his existence? I highly doubt it. In the wider music community he's nothing more than an average, competent drummer. Apart from a few fleeting flashes in the wider Oasis discography, the drumming on Dig Out Your Soul really stands out in my opinion and upon first listen was the element which immediately struck me as breaking away from the Oasis of old. A band which has been (quite rightly) accused of being backward facing, unoriginal, uninventive, unambitious and forever playing it so so safe. Zak did a really great job of improving an element of the band whose goal has always strived for being nothing more than passable. He may have pulled some questionable moves live but when it came down to adding to Noel's songwriting, no one added more variety in such a short space of time. About that in bold, I personally think the band lived up to those accusations (and surpassed them) with Dig Out Your Soul - easily the most derivative Oasis album ever made - and that's going some distance for them. Who knows - if Starkey had been with Oasis in 1995, perhaps we wouldn't be having this discussion, but then I hear him playing those songs live compared to Alan White, then I know it's definitely not nostalgia making me think White is far superior. |
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Post by The Crimson Rambler on Aug 7, 2015 10:49:15 GMT -5
Damn. Some of you guys really rate Whitey. Less than 2 full pages in and " Spectacular", " Mindblowing", " Phenomenal" & " Sublime" have all shown their faces. Either your Oasis-nostalgia is peaking into wild exaggeration territory or some people are lacking some much needed perspective. Do you think other bands fans would be jumping for joy if he joined them? Almost certainly not. If Alan played for a different band would Oasis fans even note his existence? I highly doubt it. In the wider music community he's nothing more than an average, competent drummer. Apart from a few fleeting flashes in the wider Oasis discography, the drumming on Dig Out Your Soul really stands out in my opinion and upon first listen was the element which immediately struck me as breaking away from the Oasis of old. A band which has been (quite rightly) accused of being backward facing, unoriginal, uninventive, unambitious and forever playing it so so safe. Zak did a really great job of improving an element of the band whose goal has always strived for being nothing more than passable. He may have pulled some questionable moves live but when it came down to adding to Noel's songwriting, no one added more variety in such a short space of time. It probably is a case of nostalgia for some, I happen to genuinely rate Whitey, but then onto Zak I have to disagree slightly, at least. He to my mind at least, also fits into the competent drummer range. He also played with alot of artists either backward facing or living on past glories, and unfortunately caught Oasis at the tail end of their career. I have to wonder how far in the business he would have got if he had been Zak from Surrey, as opposed to Ringo Starr's son. Zak's profile has clearly been hugely inflated thanks to his connection with The Beatles, but it has also probably given him an immediate shortcut to a wider and better musical education. Plus his continual employment by The Who (since 1996) does suggest a thing or too. I think describing his work as competent (being nothing more than acceptable) on Dig Out Your Soul is pretty harsh. I think he did a very decent job throughout. Even on poor songs like Ain't Got Nothin' and the average (GOY)HHL he did impressive work which elevated them above what I'm sure many people on here would shudder at. I don't think Noel was ever looking for musical geniuses, seeing as he gave employment to Scott McLeod but I'm sure Noel was pretty willing to take on pretty much any obedient drummer after hanging onto Tony McCarroll for some time now. I think we all know Noel's thoughts on him. |
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Post by guigsysEstring on Aug 7, 2015 11:01:40 GMT -5
It probably is a case of nostalgia for some, I happen to genuinely rate Whitey, but then onto Zak I have to disagree slightly, at least. He to my mind at least, also fits into the competent drummer range. He also played with alot of artists either backward facing or living on past glories, and unfortunately caught Oasis at the tail end of their career. I have to wonder how far in the business he would have got if he had been Zak from Surrey, as opposed to Ringo Starr's son. Zak's profile has clearly been hugely inflated thanks to his connection with The Beatles, but it has also probably given him an immediate shortcut to a wider and better musical education. Plus his continual employment by The Who (since 1996) does suggest a thing or too.I think describing his work as competent (being nothing more than acceptable) on Dig Out Your Soul is pretty harsh. I think he did a very decent job throughout. Even on poor songs like Ain't Got Nothin' and the average (GOY)HHL he did impressive work which elevated them above what I'm sure many people on here would shudder at. I don't think Noel was ever looking for musical geniuses, seeing as he gave employment to Scott McLeod but I'm sure Noel was pretty willing to take on pretty much any obedient drummer after hanging onto Tony McCarroll for some time now. I think we all know Noel's thoughts on him. Again it comes down to different perceptions- If I rephrase my description of him to decent then I would say that alot of sessions or studio drummers could also do that highlighted role. The fact he learnt from Moon who was friends with his father definitely helped, both in terms of technical drumming but also having that connection with The Who as a band. Definitely agree that he wasn't looking for geniuses, when Guigs had his breakdown a chap who played bass with Whitey called Julian Taylor was recommended. He was a far superior bassist to anything they had had, but instead plumped for Scott as they knew him, and he was a Mancunian who looked the part. A shame as they could have easily developed their sound simply by replacing departing members with quality musicians, and focusing the image more directly on the brothers alone from an earlier period. |
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Post by boneheadsbolero on Aug 7, 2015 11:01:46 GMT -5
Nobody thought Bill Bruford could be replaced but Alan stepped in and did a
great job for Yes on very short notice. Also, his playing on Lennon's Instant
Karma was incredible. The weird fill was terrific.
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Post by guigsysEstring on Aug 7, 2015 11:04:30 GMT -5
Nobody thought Bill Bruford could be replaced but Alan stepped in and did a great job for Yes on very short notice. Also, his playing on Lennon's Instant Karma was incredible. The weird fill was terrific.   Just for future reference, the two Alans  |
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Post by Mean Mrs. Mustard on Aug 7, 2015 11:05:55 GMT -5
No one said Zak was shit on record, but we were talking about live. Zak is a good drummer, but like I've already said, someone like Whitey or Sharrock fit Oasis style way better. Zak's drumming is too heavy and he just whacks the drums too hard live. I wonder what the DOYS songs would have sounded like live had Zak still been with them in 2008.
Zak really fits with The Who. But how couldn't that be? He got his only few drumming lessons from the one and only Keith Moon, and his first drumkit too. It was meant to be.
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Post by madferitusa2025 on Aug 7, 2015 11:08:26 GMT -5
Nobody thought Bill Bruford could be replaced but Alan stepped in and did a great job for Yes on very short notice. Also, his playing on Lennon's Instant Karma was incredible. The weird fill was terrific. Different Alan White. Also love the Instant Karma fills  en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_White_(Yes_drummer) |
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? NO OASIS. THAT IS THE DIFFETENCE 
