Really? What kind of head space do you think Liam gets in when he has to do vocals in the studio? How much thought, time and effort do you think he puts into his performances? Is Liam really that kind of guy? For the most part all I hear are a couple of slightly different shades of the same few things. Outside of this forum I don't think that's an unpopular opinion.

That's just an assumption on your part. I for one have said multiple times that Noel's better suited to and should have sung 'Don't Go Away'. I've also said I prefer the Noel sung versions of 'Lord Don't Slow Me Down' and 'Sad Song'. I certainly haven't just gotten used to Noel singing the former as I never bother listening to it. 

Likewise you're assuming Liam's version of most Noel sung songs are better without ever having heard him ever singing them. The sound in your head and what Liam would actually produce are probably gonna be two different things.

Less 'belted out' and approached in a slighter manner is how I was thinking. Subdued was another word I used.

Liam's quite obviously got the better and more unique voice but he really doesn't have a lot of light and shade. And neither does Noel. But the thing is this... each of the brothers sweet spot lies outside each of one anothers ranges and that's what makes them a strong combo. I think Oasis is a better band and have produced better albums by having a second vocalist to occasionally mix things up.

That's not true.

Without hearing Liam sing the song I wouldn't know. I'm certainly not longing to hear it either. He's certainly not going to elevate it by "10 times" like you said earlier in the thread.

'Married with Children' is the example of Liam doing this (and him doing it very well). Shame it was just the once, back in 1993 eh?

Like I said earlier, that's simply untrue.

Its interesting that on every single suggestion that's been given, Little James is not present on the album. 

BETTER THAN TOLSTOY ANYDAY AS YOU WERE LG X

1. Fuckin' In The Bushes
2. Go Let It Out
3. Who Feels Love?
4. Put Yer Money Where Yer Mouth Is
5. Little James
6. Gas Panic!
7. Where Did It All Go Wrong? (Noel)
8. Full On
9. Sunday Morning Call
10. One Way Road (Noel)
11. I Can See A Liar
12. Roll It Over

Of course, Liam vocals aren't what they used to be -- that would break the laws of physics. Was not arguing that at all.  But fragility is not something that comes from the vocal cords.  It comes from, for lack of a better term, the heart.  But see this is where we are going to disagree.  Either you feel what a singer is giving off deep in your bones or you don't.  I feel what Liam is giving off in those songs, and I get big-time fragile emotions that resonate with mine.  You don't.  I feel bad for you, since I find it a kick, but nothing to be done.  You get that elsewhere, I'm sure.    

As for the rest, I already know you hate the solo songs and ...c'mon everyone knows Elvis is still alive!  

Speaking of emotions, I can't listen to "Back Seat of My Car" without crying -- weird, I know, but it's all linked up to bittersweet memories.  

I have a very different interpretation than the OP. To me SOTSOG is a 9 track album. I know Noel has said he thinks an album should be at least 10 tracks, but this just doesn't fit as a standard length or longer. It's just not there so why fight it?

1.Fuckin' In The Bushes
2.Go Let It Out
3.Where Did It All Go Wrong?
4.Let's All Make Believe
5.Carry Us All
6.Gas Panic!
7.Put Your Money Where Your Mouth Is
8.Who Feels Love?
9.Roll It Over

Two Noel sung tracks, two question marks, and a new album title - Where Did It All Go Wrong? Perfect and a bit cheeky after the success/failure of Be Here Now and the "end" of Britpop.

Don't mess with FITB and GLIO as 1 and 2. That opening is iconic and we're using it to our advantage here. Tons of pop/rock albums put their only upbeat tune as tune 1 on an album, it's a known formula. Why mess with it when we have the tunes for it?

To me WFL? really breaks the flow of the album as it currently sits. So, WDIAGW? cuts off a minute in time in the 3 slot and keeps the beginning moving with the slightly more up-tempo tune instead of keeping us there for too long. And we keep the question mark, most importantly. Finally, the ending EM chord fits really nicely before the beginning of LAMB.

LAMB gets it full due as a flag-waving, middle of the album hit single it was meant to be.

Noel's Carry Us All is kind of a "classic" Oasis track from the first three albums in the middle to break up the melancholy of LAMB and Gas Panic! Also a very overlooked tune in the Oasis catalogue. It also flows into Gas Panic! very well.

PYMWYMI's opening feedback gives us one more jolt to carry us through to the final two long tunes to end the album. At this point it doesn't seem as bad as it does when it's the fourth track. A nice pick-up after the more melancholic middle.

WFL? feels a lot better as track 8 here than track 3. We're coasting to the end on some nice breezes and melodies. Take us home lads. It feels nice to have a sunnier track on the end of the album as if things are looking up after we've been through some melancholic shit.

RIO needs no introduction as the last track. Hope you didn't put your flag away just yet.

I Can See a Liar, Little James and Sunday Morning Call get moved to b-sides and with less pressure on them, become fan favorites that people will forever think should have been on the album, instead of the other way around.
Full On is still left as a could have been with Liam on vocals, still to be discussed into the 2040s.

Even with 9 tracks it still runs longer than DBTT.

It also cuts out some of the chorus synths, which is an improvement.


I think the clinging to the Oasis "formula" that Noel speaks of quite a bit now really hurt SOTSOG the most. Instead of just going with what they had they tried to make it an "Oasis" album instead. I'm sure there was a lot of pressure to do so after BHN. Anyway, this flows very well in my Spotify.

"More subtlety and emotion in his voice than almost anyone I've heard" is not a statement that could be connected to Liam Gallagher and taken seriously outside of this forum. These are the kind of questions that get asked of artists who are associated with that statement. 

When I say Liam does "a couple of slightly different shades of the same few thing" I'm saying he's not a very versatile singer. Some singer do very different things or lots of things.

I can only say I disagree. I think Liam's noteadly better at other types of songs.

You can read into it as much as you want. Liam didn't intend it and I don't hear it. I think you're really over analyzing it.

"Liam even has a tonne of subtlety when he's belting the songs out - that's why Wonderwall is one of the most iconic songs ever" You're gonna have to expand on this one pal because what I'm reading at the moment sounds troll worthy.

10 times?! C'mon. It's a 6 out of 10 song now. I highly doubt it'd be worthy of more than a 7 after. Swapping out vocal tracks can only do so much.

I'd argue there were zero songs with Liam vocals performances quite like 'Married with Children' in the Oasis discography.

I totally understand your statement and follow the logic of it but I can't answer it because as previously discussed there are songs that Liam has sung that I have said I prefer Noel singing. Maybe they like the variety? I certainly do. Maybe they the idea of two brothers singing in a band? Maybe it's something else?

live4ever.proboards.com/thread/64590/favorite-fade-away-version

Will this do? 58% of prefer Noel singing it. Kinda ruins your argument no?

I think Keep What You Got would've added something to the album, though I'm not sure how much Noel wrote vs Ian Brown though. Little By Little would've sounded better with Spike Stent production and probably Liam vocals.

FITB
Go Let It Out
Who Feels Love (Noel acoustic version)
Little By Little
Gas Panic
Let's All Make Believe
Full On (Liam version)
WDIAGW (demo version)
Keep What You Got
Roll It Over

Maybe One Way Road as a hidden track

1) In most forums I read Oasis have a mixed reaction with those who dislike the band really disliking them. It's healthy to hear these voices as they bring up things which don't get talked about on this and other Oasis forums. 

Of course - my point is that when it comes to people who simply don't like the band full-stop, or can't engage with Liam's voice at all, their opinion isn't of much worth in a meaningful discussion about those topics. They might hate Liam's voice and wish every song had been sang by Noel - that's fine, there's millions who wish Bob Dylan didn't have the voice that he did. But it's still a massive part of the appeal for those who do connect, and at the end of the day, they're the ones that matter in discussions like these. And I don't think there's any Oasis song that Liam sang that fans would switch to Noel on record if they could. Liam's voice is one of the key reasons that Oasis became what they were. I don't see any reason not to have him singing 99% of the songs, because, as I said - he's a better singer, can sing pretty much every type of Oasis song better than Noel, and the only songs that people say otherwise for are the ones that Noel already sang and people have gotten used to. 

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2) Liam obviously contributed to the bands success but these songs were classics regardless. / Wonderwall' was going to be a major, major hit regardless of who sung it.

Because of where the band were already. And a massive part of that is Liam's voice. If it wasn't for him, there's no way Oasis would have been anything close to what they were - the chances of them becoming a band with the platform to release a major hit, never mind an all-time classic like Wonderwall, would have been low. Of course, if you take a band that's already big and write them a great tune, then you can afford to get the second-best singer to sing it. Example, Don't Look Back in Anger. Take those factors away, and things clarify; I don't think Definitely Maybe would've been a classic if Noel sang it. I don't think they'd have reached a place to release major hits without Liam.

But I'll say it again - Liam's voice is absolutely an ingredient that makes Wonderwall one of the most iconic songs ever made. Obviously it's not the only thing, as if you could have the instrumental done by strangled acapella cats, but it's a massive factor. And without his vocals on earlier hits, the band would never have got to a place where they had the power to release a mainstream hit. It's the chicken and the egg - you need Noel writing the songs, you need Liam singing them. And I don't see any reason not to expand that dynamic across the whole discography. I still don't think there's more than five Oasis songs that should've been sang by Noel. I don't think there's more than five album tracks that should have been written by anyone other than Noel, either. 


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3) So it's entirely subjective. I guess that explains the differing opinions.

Well...yeah. It's music. There's probably someone out there who would want Cliff Richards to sing Supersonic. You can't account for personal taste - but you can talk more meaningfully about how a band's audience would react, and I think the audience would have been fine with Liam singing pretty much every song that he could hit. I think it would have made dozens of Oasis songs considerably better, and I think most of the reason that some people would say otherwise is because they've gotten used to the Noel singing the ones that he did. Again, the crux here is that you can either believe that in fifteen years, Oasis never once picked a song for Liam to sing that would've suited Noel more in the minds of the band's audience (the way they clearly did the other way with tracks like Full On), or that the idea of Noel "suiting" a song is mainly grounded in the fact that he did sing it.


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4) But according to you Liam turns "good songs into classics" and has the capability of improving songs by "ten times". Clearly the Noel sung version shouldn't have gotten 58% by that logic even if it somewhat different? Maybe the vocals aren't quite as important as you think?

I honestly think this poll is a laughably weak example that is doing your argument more harm than good at this point. If you have to go back ten years to find a poll with less people involved than the average school classroom, that doesn't even ask the question you're wanting to answer, to find something that suits your case, it's probably not the best thing to then showcase that as a victory. If the poll had been "Should Noel have sang Fade Away?" it would work. But it's not a poll about vocals - it's about two vastly different versions of the same song. Different mood, arrangement, production, everything. It's like having two chairs - one that's perfect leather comfort and one that's just a bare office chair. You can't then sit one in the middle of a damp field in Gloucester, and the other one on a hot beach in Malibu, and poll people as to which chair they'd rather sit on. The only variable has to be the difference between the two chairs. You'd have to find me a poll which simply asks people "Should Noel have sang [insert Liam-sang song here]?" to which most people had voted yes. And I bet that such a poll doesn't even exist, because no-one would even consider getting Noel to sing a tune once they've heard Liam do it.

I do believe, by the way, that Liam would have made the Warchild version considerably better too. 


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5) I don't think it's particularly revealing to struggle to find songs which Liam sang that the majority of fans think Noel should've sang. All Oasis fans think he's the better vocalist and the vast majority think he sang on songs which suited his voice. It's not the consensus of this forum that the band picked out songs for Noel to sing with a superhuman degree of accuracy and the vast majority of people on here would of liked Liam to have sang more songs. Off the top of my head, 'Step Out', 'Full On', 'Force of Nature' and 'Lord Don't Slow Me Down' are all commonly touted as being better suited to Liam. 

Yes, because some songs are so obviously bad for Noel to sing that even sentimental attachment can't mask the fact that Liam should have done them. But like I said, Noel's a good singer. He carries most of the tunes he sang well enough to avoid that kind of obvious backlash against his vocals - well enough for people to form an attachment to the song and then imagine that he "suited" them all along. But that's the only thing that ever makes the Oasis fandom at large ever think that he suited a song more than Liam. I feel like it should be telling that you can rattle Noel-sang songs off the top of your head that Oasis fans would have preferred Liam to sing, but have to dig up a small poll from 2011 to find something that suggests that there is even a completely different version of a song with Noel vocals that people prefer to the original version with Liam.

How many Oasis songs did the band release with Liam singing them? Hundreds. How many of them would the band's audience switch to Noel's vocals - changing nothing else about them - if they could? Seriously, how many do you think? If there was much credence to idea of Noel just suiting certain songs more than Liam, I find it very hard to believe that the band never put Liam on one of these songs even once over a fifteen year career. It tells me that Liam owns songs in a way Noel can't, and that unless people have already formed a sentimental bond to the song with Noel singing it, no-one ever thinks Noel should have sang them. To return to the point of the thread - I'd have Liam singing Sunday Morning Call, Where Did it All Go Wrong, Cigarettes in Hell, Full On, basically every SOTSOG song that he could. And I think that would make them all considerably better. 

"More subtlety and emotion in his voice than almost anyone I've heard" is statement that wouldn't be taken seriously not just by Oasis haters but by those with mixed opinions of the band and music critics too. Outside the Oasis echochamber it would be considered fanboy stuff no?

You must surely except that it's not an uncommon opinion that Noel is the preferred vocalist to sing, say, 'The Importance of Being Idle'? Saying that people only want Noel to sing it because that's the version they've gotten used to is both sweeping and condescending. 

How do you explain iconic debut singles or one-hit wonders then? 'Wonderwall' had enough gas in the tank it needed to be successful with or without Oasis. It's its own beast.

The audience is fine with Noel singing the majority of the songs he did. I've only ever heard yourself make such a big deal out of it. 

You don't know why Noel sung the songs he did. You're basing your argument off things you're imaging in your head!

All I did was use the search function to find a thread containing the word "Fade" in Polling Station. I was specifically searching for a poll on Fade Away vs Fade Away (Warchild Version). Your criticism on how many people voted on such a poll and when it was conducted sets completely unrealistic expectations on what resources are available. 

I never even argued against this point. Going back through the messages you said "the only quality to an Oasis song that truly makes people think that Noel should have sang it is that he did sing it and now that's how they think of the song." I said that was "untrue" and in response you then challenged me to "find me a single song sang by Liam that even 10% of the fanbase think that Noel should have sang instead" and I wrongly bothered to entertain it for a quick find I could throw your way. I've already addressed my thoughts on this statement in the last paragraph of the last message. Under the circumstances I don't find it particularly revealing.

The point I was arguing against was that "the only quality to an Oasis song that truly makes people think that Noel should have sang it is that he did sing it and now that's how they think of the song." The fact you've previously said 'Talk Tonight' and 'Half the World Away' should have been sung by Noel goes completely against your own argument. I challenge you to explain why, as the inferior vocalist, you previously stated you'd give them to Noel. Have fun.

All 4 of these songs are considered less suited to Noel and more suited to Liam because of the electric guitars, tempo and whatnot. Not because he isn't carrying the tune. Liam recorded vocals to both 'Step Out' and 'LDSMD' and they were both rejected. He was unable to sing 'Force of Nature' and I would speculate the same is true of 'Full On'. If people are simply forming attachments to vocals they're used to, again, explain why you previously stated you'd give a couple of songs to Noel?

1) "More subtlety and emotion in his voice than almost anyone I've heard" is statement that wouldn't be taken seriously not just by Oasis haters but by those with mixed opinions of the band and music critics too. Outside the Oasis echochamber it would be considered fanboy stuff no?

Well, not by anyone who wasn't being rude about it. I don't know what point you're making here; Liam Gallagher is one of my favourite vocalists, and - like millions of others - I find his voice to be chocked-full of dynamics and emotion. And even if people on a forum for a different band would consider me a "fanboy" for that, so what? I am an Oasis fan. Music critics can think what they want about Liam's vocals - I'm more concerned with how Oasis fans feel about them. Judging the singer of a band by the reaction of people who don't particularly like them is like asking someone who doesn't particularly like football if the match on Wednesday was boring or not. They're allowed their opinion, but it's something of a dead end if you want a meaningful conversation. 

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2) He was unable to sing 'Force of Nature' and I would speculate the same is true of 'Full On'. / You must accept that it's not an uncommon opinion that Noel is the preferred vocalist to sing, say, 'The Importance of Being Idle'?

Of course. I've said multiple times that I'm fine with Noel singing the songs that Liam couldn't hit. I've also acknowledged that if you did a poll, there's an awful lot of Noel-sung songs that the fandom would say they'd prefer Noel on. My point is that this is due to the fact that they've lived with those songs as Noel songs the entire time - they've bonded with them with those vocals, they think of the melody with those vocals, and so an undefinable sense of "Noelness" has been added to them in the average Oasis fan's mind. Nothing condescending about that, happens to everyone. But like I said - the one defining trait of Oasis songs that Oasis fans would say "suits Noel" is that Noel did sing them and now that's just how most of us think of the songs. It's not because he would actually sing them better - unless Liam physically couldn't carry the song, of course.

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3) How do you explain iconic debut singles or one-hit wonders then?

Why would I need to? My point is not that hit songs never happen in isolation, but that Oasis, as a band that came out of the distorted noise of the indie scene in the early nineties, would never have gotten to the point where they could release a crossover radio hit at the enduring level of Wonderwall if Noel had been singing from the start. Like I said, Definitely Maybe with Noel vocals isn't a classic. Liam adds that next level of brilliance, to songs like Married With Children or Bring it On Down. His voice is a massive part of how they got to a level to make Wonderwall such a hit, and it's a massive part of what makes Wonderwall stand out as one of the most iconic songs of it's generation. 

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4) The audience is fine with Noel singing the majority of the songs he did.

I've acknowledged this right from the start, and have typed out why I think that's the case about five times now. Noel is a fine singer, but Liam is a better one - it's the connection people have formed with the songs Noel sang that leads them to believe there's something in the song that inherently "suits Noel", rather than anything about the track that actually does. And again, until you can name me a single Liam-sang song that the fandom would switch to Noel vocals if they had the choice, I'll continue to believe that this is a much more likely theory of songs "suiting Noel", than the one which requires me to believe that the band never once mis-attributed a song to Liam in their entire fifteen year history. Noel has anomalies - Liam does not.

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5) You don't know why Noel sung the songs he did. You're basing your argument off things you're imaging in your head!

Hand on heart, got no idea what you're on about.

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6) I was specifically searching for a poll on Fade Away vs Fade Away (Warchild Version). Your criticism on how many people voted on such a poll and when it was conducted sets completely unrealistic expectations on what resources are available. You challenged me to "find me a single song sang by Liam that even 10% of the fanbase think that Noel should have sang instead" and I wrongly bothered to entertain it for a quick find I could throw your way. 

I feel like you must know why you're wrong about this. Surely, you can see that the poll you found doesn't fit the criteria it would have to - a poll asking about two completely different versions of a track can't be used to show that people would prefer the singer on the one chosen to sing the song as a whole. The change in vocals is just one of many massive differences between the two. The fact that it's a poll of 29 people from ten years ago just adds to the slight comedy of it - it's a pretty rickety gauge of opinion on something that doesn't even prove the point you're making in the first place.

But you're right that there's unlikely to be a poll for what I'm asking - partly because people don't do that many polls on here or even Oasis Facebook, and partly because not many people entertain the thought of Noel singing anything that Liam did. So, tell you what, bit more casual - just name one. You don't have to back it up with figures, I promise not to be a dickhead and I will admit if you think of one that I can't. Just one Oasis song with Liam vocals that you think the fanbase would swap to Noel vocals (not a Noel version, just the vocals) if they could. The same way they'd probably swap Liam onto Full On, for instance. Even with my attachment theory, there are still outliers for Noel. Can you name one for Liam? If not, this suggests what most Oasis fans already know - that Liam is just one of those top-tier vocalists than instantly owns a song when he sings them. And I think he'd do just the same to The Masterplan, Sunday Morning Call, or Falling Down if given the chance.

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7) The fact you've previously said 'Talk Tonight' and 'Half the World Away' should have been sung by Noel goes completely against your own argument. I challenge you to explain why, as the inferior vocalist, you previously stated you'd give them to Noel. Have fun.

First of all, no, it doesn't. My entire point is that people form sentimental attachments to songs with their original vocals and this leads them to not only want to keep them as they are, but in this case to ascribe a certain "Noelness" to the songs that makes it the right choice all along. I'm just as susceptible to the former as anyone else. It's the latter I'm disagreeing with. 

Although, this discussion just made me imagine the song with Liam giving it some Married-With-Children style vocals, and I have to say I think I think I'd prefer that. That will happen to most people with most songs they like - it becomes defined by the person who sung the version they connect with. It speaks volumes that there are Noel-sung songs that fans at large would switch to Liam, but basically none the other way around. Noel needs to have sang the version people have connected with to make people think the songs suits him. Not the case for Liam. I'm fine with people saying that in this timeline, they'd keep things as they are. I get that. It's the timeline we've lived in. My point is that Oasis would have enjoyed more success and quality if Liam had been given all these songs from the start, and improved them with his superior vocals. 

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8) If people are simply forming attachments to vocals they're used to, again, explain why you previously stated you'd give a couple of songs to Noel?

Because I've formed attachments to them. Feel like this "gotcha" needed a second draft... And like I said, now that I think about it, even my attachments to those songs would probably have been enhanced if Liam had sang them from the start. 

At the end of the day, if there was a magic red button that could change the history of Oasis so that Liam sang every song that he physically could have done, I'd press it. I think I'd emerge into an alternative timeline where the band had a higher average quality of tracks, and where I'd be treated to the best vocalist of his generation singing more tunes from the best song-writer. Again, back to the thread, SOTSOG would be a better album. Written by Noel, sang by Liam. That's the magic combo. 

What was this thread about again?