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Post by jxing on Jun 6, 2019 18:56:33 GMT -5
www.rte.ie/entertainment/2019/0606/1053687-oasis-feud-shocked-director-of-new-liam-documentary/The director of a new film about Liam Gallagher’s solo career has said he was shocked when he witnessed the bitterness and seriousness of the feud between Liam and his older brother Noel. Watch our interview with Gavin FitzGerald - warning video contains strong language. Speaking to RTÉ Entertainment, Liam Gallagher - As It Was director Gavin FitzGerald said, "I was shocked to find out that Noel and Liam haven’t seen each other, haven’t even bumped into each other, since 2009 when they had a fight backstage in Paris and were swinging guitars at each other and didn’t come out to play for fans. "The feud is real and it’s sad to see because at the end of the day they’re brothers and they go to great lengths not to see each other." [https://img-rasset-ie]Liam in a scene from As It Was As It Was may be full of funny scenes of Liam talking about his estranged brother but FitzGerald also witnessed real dislike from the younger Gallagher for his older sibling. "Liam is very open about talking about Noel," he said. [https://img-rasset-ie]Gavin FitzGerald: "The fact that I’m Irish certainly helped." "But I was cautious about bringing him up because you’re bringing up those bad feelings but Liam is the one who says he’s always bringing him up. Liam’s emotions about Noel range from genuinely missing him to anger. "I brought Liam some Tayto crisps and some Barry’s tea because of his Irish connections." "It’s almost like it happened yesterday even though it’s ten years," FitzGerald added. "They’re brothers, they’re inseparable. Oasis will always be known as Noel and Liam and they’re both at the moment on their own solo careers and whether they like it or not, there is competition." The new film follows the younger Gallagher in the aftermath of the Oasis split as he struggles to form a new band, the launch of his short-lived band Beady Eye, his divorce, and how he found his feet again with new partner and manager Debbie Gwyther before finally launching his solo career in 2017. [https://img-rasset-ie]Liam Gallagher - As It Was premieres in Irish cinemas on Thursday night It’s somewhat of a companion piece to 2016 Oasis documentary Supersonic and FitzGerald was asked to make the film after Liam saw the director’s Conor McGregor film Notorious. The pair immediately hit it off. "Liam sawNotorious on a plane journey and he already had a film about his life in production and they needed a change of direction and a new injection of energy so I got a call from Liam’s label and they flew me over to meet Liam. [https://img-rasset-ie]As it Was "I brought him some Tayto crisps and some Barry’s tea because of his Irish connections, I had a chat with him and it was almost like 'you got the job!' Hahaha. The fact that I’m Irish certainly helped. He genuinely has a fondness for Ireland and his Irish fans." Liam Gallagher - As It Was premieres tonight in cinemas in Dublin, Cork, Limerick, Galway, Lisburn and Belfast, followed by a live performance from Liam broadcast from London. Full details here.
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Post by fartpanic on Jun 9, 2019 8:12:46 GMT -5
Why do they claim they haven't seen each other in 10 years when its on record from both brothers that they have?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 8:16:37 GMT -5
as I said yesterday, there has to be more to than this than we know. I can't believe this is all over a bust up in oasis that happened nearly a decade ago, things seem worse now more than ever.
things even seemed to go over cliff as far back as 2008. They didnt seem on good terms throughout the whole of that last tour.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 9:30:05 GMT -5
things even seemed to go over cliff as far back as 2008. They didnt seem on good terms throughout the whole of that last tour.
Noel wrote a load of weird shit on his tour blog about it. I'm sure his version would be that it started when Liam ran off to get married instead of recording a couple of the songs that could and should have been on DOYS, but I find it hard to believe that recording arrangements for a massive band were really that inflexible. By the end of that tour it was fucking weird. Liam was insanely angry on stage and I remember watching him sit on the drum riser watching Noel do a song - I think it was Half the World Away - at the Roundhouse, which I don't think he'd done in 15 years. I guess his way of expressing his feelings was on stage whereas Noel was more articulate and could write his blogs. I get the impression that Liam genuinely fucking hates Noel's wife and the feeling is mutual. I doubt anybody outside of immediate circles really knows why or how fair any of it is. My view is that Oasis died the day Liam signed his contract with Warner Brothers. The only way they ever would have got back together was if Liam hit rock bottom and Peggy or Paul appealed to Noel's power complex to dig Liam back out of the hole. That's no longer a possibility, so they won't ever work together again.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 9:35:47 GMT -5
things even seemed to go over cliff as far back as 2008. They didnt seem on good terms throughout the whole of that last tour.
Noel wrote a load of weird shit on his tour blog about it. I'm sure his version would be that it started when Liam ran off to get married instead of recording a couple of the songs that could and should have been on DOYS, but I find it hard to believe that recording arrangements for a massive band were really that inflexible. By the end of that tour it was fucking weird. Liam was insanely angry on stage and I remember watching him sit on the drum riser watching Noel do a song - I think it was Half the World Away - at the Roundhouse, which I don't think he'd done in 15 years. I guess his way of expressing his feelings was on stage whereas Noel was more articulate and could write his blogs. I get the impression that Liam genuinely fucking hates Noel's wife and the feeling is mutual. I doubt anybody outside of immediate circles really knows why or how fair any of it is. My view is that Oasis died the day Liam signed his contract with Warner Brothers. The only way they ever would have got back together was if Liam hit rock bottom and Peggy or Paul appealed to Noel's power complex to dig Liam back out of the hole. That's no longer a possibility, so they won't ever work together again. the only thing that was publicly known that could connect Liam to Noels wife is the whole issue with Liam cheating on his wife as I believe they were all friends within the same circle. Its perfectly possible that she took a dim view to Liam for doing what he did and maybe things just kind of degraded from that point and things got said in both directions.
I think Liam also made some rant not long ago that she was responsible for oasis breaking up so maybe the issues go back even further than that.
who knows I guess. Like I say, I think there is probably a lot of information that we arnt knowledgable of. Seems like more personal issues than just a musical disagreement that has escalated.
Its like oasis gets used as this centre for the anger but I reckon that problems between Noel and Liam run deeper than that, who knows what has gone on in their personal lives.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 9:47:12 GMT -5
I think I expect different things of different people. That might not seem totally fair but I do think you make allowances for experience. Liam is - or at least has been - an overgrown child. He went from his mum's house to being a multimillionaire and the face of the biggest band in the world. As far as I can tell, he never had to grow up until Beady Eye failed. From the day he left Manchester until the day he found out Beady Eye didn't have the money to tour the US properly, he did more or less whatever he wanted and the boring bits were done for him. Noel had made his own life, been around the world, before Oasis happened. I tend to see their respective behaviour through that lens.
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Post by mancraider on Jun 9, 2019 10:11:20 GMT -5
It's made clear at the end of As It Was that Liam begged Noel to resurrect Oasis cos he was broke and had no where else to turn, but Noel blanked him. Of course Noel is entitled to do what he wants but if your prepared to see you little brother in the gutter and do nothing to help him then the word family no longer has any meaning. Now Liam has got himself back on an even keel by himself i would imagine he feels a lot of resentment to Noel over it.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 10:14:16 GMT -5
It's made clear at the end of As It Was that Liam begged Noel to resurrect Oasis cos he was broke and had no where else to turn, but Noel blanked him. Of course Noel is entitled to do what he wants but if your prepared to see you little brother in the gutter Liam's gutter was different to our gutters, though. He was on holiday getting hammered and telling people he was retired. It's not like he was struggling to pay bills.
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Post by mancraider on Jun 9, 2019 10:29:43 GMT -5
It's made clear at the end of As It Was that Liam begged Noel to resurrect Oasis cos he was broke and had no where else to turn, but Noel blanked him. Of course Noel is entitled to do what he wants but if your prepared to see you little brother in the gutter Liam's gutter was different to our gutters, though. He was on holiday getting hammered and telling people he was retired. It's not like he was struggling to pay bills. true, although who knows how bad things could of got if his music career had been completely over. Doesnt make the feelings of being let down by people around you any less real. I mean I don't have much sympathy for Liam myself, he's hurt plenty of people himself and still got a great life at the end of it but I don't really buy into the notion that because someone has money they no right to complain about their life. It all relative. I don't think there is any way back for them, certainly as Oasis and most probably as brothers. If they were going to come back together it would have been when one needed the other and that was when Liam was at rock bottom. Now Liam is back what is the reason? Only one is a big payday and I don't think either would do it just for the money.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 10:40:28 GMT -5
It's made clear at the end of As It Was that Liam begged Noel to resurrect Oasis cos he was broke and had no where else to turn, but Noel blanked him. Of course Noel is entitled to do what he wants but if your prepared to see you little brother in the gutter and do nothing to help him then the word family no longer has any meaning. Now Liam has got himself back on an even keel by himself i would imagine he feels a lot of resentment to Noel over it. wow is that right? damn.
like its been said though, its not like Liam had to take up a job as a toilet cleaner between beady eye and as you were though. He was still jetting off to other countries and generally doing nothing. To most people that would be living the high life as opposed to being in the gutter.
its all perspective I suppose. Still sad to hear that Noel showing that attitude towards Liam though. Im kind of glad that oasis wasnt reformed on that basis though.
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Post by sfsorrow on Jun 9, 2019 10:41:09 GMT -5
I think Liam considers himself to be quite class-conscious - someone who is working class and maintains those roots and also remains an antagonistic relationship and attitude to the other classes. His comments about Noel now seem very much to stem from that. I think he probably sees Sara as someone who represents a different set of class values from his own. And I wouldn't be surprised if on some level (maybe not even consciously) he believes that Sara has brainwashed Noel to abandon his own working class roots. So from his perspective I think his criticisms about Noel all stem from that - him playing with U2, him not playing in the first Manchester show, him making cosmic pop. Because he sees so much through the prism of class, he thinks that Noel is trying to ingratiate himself with a culture that Liam rejects outright as a matter of principle. And I think he believes that Sara is the driving force behind all of this.
I'm not saying I agree with him but I think it is his perspective.
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Post by Nyron Nosworthy on Jun 9, 2019 11:53:50 GMT -5
Something that I think is overlooked is the attack on Noel in Canada at the start of the DOYS tour. In his victim statement, Noel said he spent the entire tour in chronic pain and miserable. It's likely that Liam's antics on tour would piss him off a lot more when he's in constant pain, whereas in normal circumstances he'd have let them go and it would have blown over. Which would tie in with Liam's version of events that he didn't really do anything different/wrong and Noel was looking for a way out.
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Post by drummert5 on Jun 9, 2019 12:11:37 GMT -5
Noel's never really commented on this (and probably can't for legal reasons, if it looks like Noel abandoned Oasis gigs because he wanted to go solo that could be tricky), but I look at the following chain of events:
- Noel discovering enjoying singing his songs on his own on stage with TIOBI in 2005 - Liams voice being well and truly in the gutter in 2006/7 - Noel doing a bunch of really well received solo gigs in 2006/7 - Liam not being arsed to finish the album properly in 2007
...it's not hard to imagine Noel looking for a way out and seeing Oasis as more of a hindrance than a help. Once you're already in that mindset, you'll take any excuse/make an argument out of anything. It's a shame that they've apparently had such a dramatic personal falling out as a result, but the musical trajectory had a certain inevitability about it I think. If you want to pick "a moment" when Oasis died, I'd pick Glastonbury '04.
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Post by sfsorrow on Jun 9, 2019 12:33:28 GMT -5
Again, I'm not giving personal opinion here but just guessing at a perspective. But I think along with the things mentioned in the above posts, I do think that it is worth considering Noel's background as a victim of child abuse. And while Liam was a victim of it as well, it was different. I don't know the full truth of what happened that night in Paris and maybe Noel's version is not 100% accurate but I believe that he believes it. And for him, the memory of those last few days is mostly Liam's drunkenness and his erratic and violent behaviour that he described as "scary."
I think that given Noel's past experiences with similar behaviour, it was very hard to psychologically cope with that. I don't think he would ever characterize it that way but I think that's part of what was going on and had been going on for years. This is not to say that Noel's behaviour wasn't passive aggressive - his constant leaving the band and leaving the tour as a covert attempt to try and change Liam, was never an appropriate way of dealing with the problem and quite predictably it never worked. But I think Noel suddenly came to some awareness that night in Paris which was, why do I keep putting myself through this because he's never going to change. And it's not like Noel is going to say, "Liam, we need to go to therapy together to work this out," so he just entirely walks away from the situation in much the same way that he completely ignores his father.
So again, from his perspective, I do think that "being friendly" with Liam is akin to being friendly with someone who causes him a great deal of psychological anguish.
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Post by Derrick on Jun 9, 2019 12:38:36 GMT -5
Noel's never really commented on this (and probably can't for legal reasons, if it looks like Noel abandoned Oasis gigs because he wanted to go solo that could be tricky), but I look at the following chain of events: - Noel discovering enjoying singing his songs on his own on stage with TIOBI in 2005 - Liams voice being well and truly in the gutter in 2006/7 - Noel doing a bunch of really well received solo gigs in 2006/7 - Liam not being arsed to finish the album properly in 2007 ...it's not hard to imagine Noel looking for a way out and seeing Oasis as more of a hindrance than a help. Once you're already in that mindset, you'll take any excuse/make an argument out of anything. It's a shame that they've apparently had such a dramatic personal falling out as a result, but the musical trajectory had a certain inevitability about it I think. If you want to pick "a moment" when Oasis died, I'd pick Glastonbury '04. That's what I think as well. If they hadn't split in Paris there would most likely have been a long break before the next Oasis album, during which Noel would probably have released a solo album, which would have inevitably made an unemployed Liam irate, cue more rants on Twitter & their relationship deteriorating. The main thing was Noel feeling musically constrained in Oasis after all these years, they'd overcome brotherly strife before but there was something more in the equation in 2009.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 12:50:40 GMT -5
Again, I'm not giving personal opinion here but just guessing at a perspective. But I think along with the things mentioned in the above posts, I do think that it is worth considering Noel's background as a victim of child abuse. And while Liam was a victim of it as well, it was different. I don't know the full truth of what happened that night in Paris and maybe Noel's version is not 100% accurate but I believe that he believes it. And for him, the memory of those last few days is mostly Liam's drunkenness and his erratic and violent behaviour that he described as "scary." I think that given Noel's past experiences with similar behaviour, it was very hard to psychologically cope with that. I don't think he would ever characterize it that way but I think that's part of what was going on and had been going on for years. This is not to say that Noel's behaviour wasn't passive aggressive - his constant leaving the band and leaving the tour as a covert attempt to try and change Liam, was never an appropriate way of dealing with the problem and quite predictably it never worked. But I think Noel suddenly came to some awareness that night in Paris which was, why do I keep putting myself through this because he's never going to change. And it's not like Noel is going to say, "Liam, we need to go to therapy together to work this out," so he just entirely walks away from the situation in much the same way that he completely ignores his father. So again, from his perspective, I do think that "being friendly" with Liam is akin to being friendly with someone who causes him a great deal of psychological anguish. Come on, Noel famously beat Liam with a cricket bat, he was capable of being violent too.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 12:59:58 GMT -5
again, still interesting that Noel paints Liam as this violent, angry individual that he couldnt work with any longer yet paul has no problem in maintaining a relationship with him and the remaining members of oasis didnt take the chance to run away from this impossible individual instead sticking around to make two further albums with him.
then youve got people like tony mccarrol who I believe has even said Noel bullied him due to his drumming ability and bonehead still remains close friends with liam despite leaving the band around 20 years ago yet seemingly doesnt have any contact with Noel at all.
Noel aint a saint and I think youve only got to look at who actually maintains contact with Liam to see that Liam clearly isnt as bad as Noel likes to portray.
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Post by sfsorrow on Jun 9, 2019 13:01:31 GMT -5
Again, I'm not giving personal opinion here but just guessing at a perspective. But I think along with the things mentioned in the above posts, I do think that it is worth considering Noel's background as a victim of child abuse. And while Liam was a victim of it as well, it was different. I don't know the full truth of what happened that night in Paris and maybe Noel's version is not 100% accurate but I believe that he believes it. And for him, the memory of those last few days is mostly Liam's drunkenness and his erratic and violent behaviour that he described as "scary." I think that given Noel's past experiences with similar behaviour, it was very hard to psychologically cope with that. I don't think he would ever characterize it that way but I think that's part of what was going on and had been going on for years. This is not to say that Noel's behaviour wasn't passive aggressive - his constant leaving the band and leaving the tour as a covert attempt to try and change Liam, was never an appropriate way of dealing with the problem and quite predictably it never worked. But I think Noel suddenly came to some awareness that night in Paris which was, why do I keep putting myself through this because he's never going to change. And it's not like Noel is going to say, "Liam, we need to go to therapy together to work this out," so he just entirely walks away from the situation in much the same way that he completely ignores his father. So again, from his perspective, I do think that "being friendly" with Liam is akin to being friendly with someone who causes him a great deal of psychological anguish. Come on, Noel famously beat Liam with a cricket bat, he was capable of being violent too. Noel's own violent behaviour wouldn't alter the fact that he wanted to leave a relationship that he himself felt uncomfortable in, in part because of someone else's violence. Nevertheless, in many of the situations where I am aware of Noel using violence, it typically comes from a place of acting defensively rather than offensively (this is not to say that beating someone with a cricket bat is an excusable form of self-defense in this particular case): www.shortlist.com/news/liam-noel-gallagher-argument-feud-insultsDuring the recording of What's the Story, Morning Glory, Liam decides to nip out for a pint, only to return with a plethora of wildly intoxicated people, much to the disdain of Noel. Noel being the sensible chap he is, forces his brother's new friends to leave the studio. Liam doesn't like this and loses it, attacking Noel and his guitars. In retaliation, Noel cracks Liam over the head with a cricket bat
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 13:10:41 GMT -5
again, still interesting that Noel paints Liam as this violent, angry individual that he couldnt work with any longer yet paul has no problem in maintaining a relationship with him and the remaining members of oasis didnt take the chance to run away from this impossible individual instead sticking around to make two further albums with him. then youve got people like tony mccarrol who I believe has even said Noel bullied him due to his drumming ability and bonehead still remains close friends with liam despite leaving the band around 20 years ago yet seemingly doesnt have any contact with Noel at all. Noel aint a saint and I think youve only got to look at who actually maintains contact with Liam to see that Liam clearly isnt as bad as Noel likes to portray. I might be wrong because it's been a long time since I've read it but I think Ian Robertson's book says similar things about Noel acting at a distance.
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Post by sfsorrow on Jun 9, 2019 13:13:42 GMT -5
again, still interesting that Noel paints Liam as this violent, angry individual that he couldnt work with any longer yet paul has no problem in maintaining a relationship with him and the remaining members of oasis didnt take the chance to run away from this impossible individual instead sticking around to make two further albums with him. then youve got people like tony mccarrol who I believe has even said Noel bullied him due to his drumming ability and bonehead still remains close friends with liam despite leaving the band around 20 years ago yet seemingly doesnt have any contact with Noel at all. Noel aint a saint and I think youve only got to look at who actually maintains contact with Liam to see that Liam clearly isnt as bad as Noel likes to portray. There's a few things here: I'm not necessarily talking about reality, I'm talking about Noel's perspective. But let's say, for argument sake that Liam violence was abusive enough to justify Noel leaving: 1. When a wife leaves an abusive husband, it is not a valid argument to say "she wasn't a saint herself." 2. As Noel's mother said in the Live Forever documentary, his father "would kill him." He didn't kill Gem, Andy Bell, or Chris Sharrock, he killed Noel. Furthermore, the abuse had such an effect on Noel that he developed the psychological scar of the stammer that he eventually overcame. So I think it's fair to say that Noel might be a bit less able to tolerate that sort of behaviour than the other members of the band are. 3. I don't know what Liam's relationship with Paul Gallagher is. I don't know if Liam has questioned the legitimacy of his children, consistently mocked him in the press, threateningly swung a guitar at him, and violated his personal space in public. Even if this has all happened (which I doubt), you don't necessarily expect every person who has been abused to react to behaviour in the same way. Again, hypothetically, if Noel finds this situation to be psychologically troubling, to say "Paul tolerates this, why can't you Noel?" isn't really fair to Noel's own individual experiences and feelings. Again, though, I'm not saying I agree with Noel, I'm just trying to understand his point of view.
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Post by Bonehead's Barber on Jun 9, 2019 16:00:08 GMT -5
There's definitely a lot of shit that goes years back between the two. However, there's also a lot of bad blood between them that is fresh.
I appreciate that Noel has been a wanker to Liam but the ONLY way that Noel is ever going to reform Oasis is if Liam stops slagging him off and apologises. That will never happen.
Liam has (rightly or wrongly) slagged of Noel's wife, insinuated that Noel doesn't give a fuck about the Manchester bombing, sued him, and constantly dug at him in the press.
I look back at the Chasing Yesterday tour. Noel was actualy quite lukewarm towards Liam. I specifically remember him saying something along the lines of how he sees him in the paper and thinks 'aww bless' or something like that. Obviously it was tongue in cheek, but compared to the most recent cycle where he said that he wants Donald Trump and Liam to both go head to head in driverless cars and blow themselves up... it was progress!
It was no coincidence that that was during a period where Liam was in the gutter, and wasn't sniping away at Noel.
I may be adding 2 and 2 together and getting 5, but seemingly (and perfectly reasonably) don't be a wanker to Noel and he won't be a wanker back.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 16:10:20 GMT -5
I do remember an interview where Noel commented on the whole cheating thing with Liam and said that the good thing about hitting rock bottom if that you have the chance to wash it all out and start again before going on to say that he should put his name up in lights and go solo and saying Liam was one of the last of his kind. it was a fairly warm comment I seem to remember but that mustve been one of the last he made. He certainly hasnt spoken positively of Liam for some years.
again though, I don't believe Noel was thinking Liam would go to someone like warner brothers and use songwriters, at which point Noel suddenly seemed to get a stick up his ass, even insulting ashcroft in the process. I expect the recent dislike for Noels musical direction has only annoyed him further because whatever he says about "enjoying what hes doing", Im sure Noels ego still wants to be getting the more successful albums etc.
Noel was probably quite happy for Liam to go solo if he only wrote his own songs because in his mind, it would just be another beady eye, sitting comfortably beneath him.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 16:10:33 GMT -5
I look back at the Chasing Yesterday tour. Noel was actualy quite lukewarm towards Liam. I specifically remember him saying something along the lines of how he sees him in the paper and thinks 'aww bless' or something like that. Obviously it was tongue in cheek, but compared to the most recent cycle where he said that he wants Donald Trump and Liam to both go head to head in driverless cars and blow themselves up... it was progress! It was no coincidence that that was during a period where Liam was in the gutter, and wasn't sniping away at Noel. I may be adding 2 and 2 together and getting 5, but seemingly (and perfectly reasonably) don't be a wanker to Noel and he won't be a wanker back. I just think you've drawn the wrong conclusion. Noel was happy to low-key support Liam when he wasn't competition. When Liam started doing well, Noel's attitude changed.
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Post by Binary Sunset on Jun 9, 2019 16:47:28 GMT -5
Why do they claim they haven't seen each other in 10 years when its on record from both brothers that they have? Because they constantly tell lies.
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Post by Rolo on Jun 9, 2019 16:53:28 GMT -5
Watching As It Was made it very clear that Liam really misses Noel. It was obvious anyway but a few things that were said in the film backed it up further. Think someone said something about everything Liam does is for an audience of 1 and that's Noel.
Liam would make up in a heartbeat if Noel wanted to.
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