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Post by Lennon2217 on Jun 2, 2019 21:13:26 GMT -5
This thread topic should give up.
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Post by dampcottage on Sept 10, 2021 16:45:58 GMT -5
Why would he give up,there's always a chance he might come up with something great again, but if he ever gets any money out of bittersweet symphony he might as well pack it in, because he would become absolutely fuckin awful, and no more verve reunions, I like forth but it would have been perfect left alone after urban hymns 14th April 2019 I said that, 23rd may he got the royalties back, now he's fucked |
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Post by captainsoul on Sept 11, 2021 6:54:10 GMT -5
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Post by jh on Sept 11, 2021 9:01:30 GMT -5
Guy hasn't sold out or compromised at all. Ok he may have run dry on ideas but that doesnt mean he should give up. What a unique voice and charisma - silent, brooding then a deadly retort. Give up not a chance. |
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Post by matt on Sept 11, 2021 14:19:32 GMT -5
Yes. He was never as talented as him or his fans believed.
Nearly a quarter of a century since he wrote anything of interest. Real talent wouldn't be so bereft of anything in that time since.
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Post by captainsoul on Sept 12, 2021 4:47:45 GMT -5
Yes. He was never as talented as him or his fans believed. Nearly a quarter of a century since he wrote anything of interest. Real talent wouldn't be so bereft of anything in that time since.  |
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Post by funhouse on Sept 12, 2021 4:54:55 GMT -5
I'm not engaged with this topic, but just reading the title to this thread always cracks me up.
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Post by The Escapist on Sept 12, 2021 7:04:07 GMT -5
^
Most of those songs are pretty dull, to me. If they're the best the last two decades of Ashcroft has to offer, then it's not a great state of affairs. There's just a massive atmosphere of David Brent hanging over his solo career. All the power and mystique of The Verve replaced with mid-tempo strummers with faux-deep lyrics and cringey vocals and videos where he's riding motorbikes in the woods and looking earnest. Interesting how you could argue that 1997 had career-long negative impacts on both Noel and Ashcroft, but one with success and one with failure. Be Here Now stopped Noel throwing the kitchen sink and having actual fun with a record for twenty years, Urban Hymns seems to have convinced Ashcroft that endless reattempts to write Lucky Man is the best idea for his career. He seems to have gone from this:
To this:
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Post by Lennon2217 on Sept 12, 2021 9:48:08 GMT -5
It’s hilarious that after 22 years, Jagger and Richards said Ashcroft could have full royalties from Bittersweet Symphony. Once all the juice was squeezed from the song via album sales, single sales, radio play, MTV play, iTunes downloads and streams. Thanks guys!!!! They should have done the right thing in the first place. Nobody would ever confuse BSS with the Stones “The Last Time”. In 1997 it was damn near impossible to even find that rare orchestra cover to begin with. True colors shown. Granted Klein was gonna Klein but Mick and Keith should have done their part in this fiasco to help a fellow artist. Stones did plenty of rip offs in their day.
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Post by matt on Sept 12, 2021 9:51:40 GMT -5
^ Most of those songs are pretty dull, to me. If they're the best the last two decades of Ashcroft has to offer, then it's not a great state of affairs. There's just a massive atmosphere of David Brent hanging over his solo career. All the power and mystique of The Verve replaced with mid-tempo strummers with faux-deep lyrics and cringey vocals and videos where he's riding motorbikes in the woods and looking earnest. Interesting how you could argue that 1997 had career-long negative impacts on both Noel and Ashcroft, but one with success and one with failure. Be Here Now stopped Noel throwing the kitchen sink and having actual fun with a record for twenty years, Urban Hymns seems to have convinced Ashcroft that endless reattempts to write Lucky Man is the best idea for his career. He seems to have gone from this: To this: They really are scraping the barrel - not being funny, but Free Love Freeway is genuinely less parodic, and more memorable a tune, than the above at times. I despise him because he ruined The Verve, a genuinely great band, and ruined his own talent with his stinking attitude. It's not the kind of dislike for say, a band like Kasabian where it's always been loutish knobhead music written by loutish knobheads - Ashcroft genuinely had it all going for him at one time and it went all to his head. If he had any ounce of humility, he'd still be a great frontman in a great band, potentially still producing great songs at the inspiration of his bandmates. But his unbearable ego shot The Verve down, and I really pity all the immensely talented band members who had to put up with such a diva. A hellish waste of a good band. For him, he was the be all and end all and nobody else mattered. He's a joke figure now, writing joke music for himself while deluding himself that his stuff actually matters. Really is David Brent stuff. |
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Post by glider on Sept 13, 2021 0:01:54 GMT -5
There was a time where I used to listen to this song every day - entranced by its sonic beauty and cosmic grooves. An unbending seven minute traversal on an interstellar highway.
All I've ever wanted from Richard is good music, if he was going to go without the other guys. It's clear he'll never make music as brilliant as he did with them, and his utter refusal to show humility and trot around with his god complex and shitty platitudes infested on every single lifetime movie soundtrack he releases every few years is one of the biggest losses to the craft of music in modern times.
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Post by Lennon2217 on Sept 13, 2021 8:48:24 GMT -5
^ Most of those songs are pretty dull, to me. If they're the best the last two decades of Ashcroft has to offer, then it's not a great state of affairs. There's just a massive atmosphere of David Brent hanging over his solo career. All the power and mystique of The Verve replaced with mid-tempo strummers with faux-deep lyrics and cringey vocals and videos where he's riding motorbikes in the woods and looking earnest. Interesting how you could argue that 1997 had career-long negative impacts on both Noel and Ashcroft, but one with success and one with failure. Be Here Now stopped Noel throwing the kitchen sink and having actual fun with a record for twenty years, Urban Hymns seems to have convinced Ashcroft that endless reattempts to write Lucky Man is the best idea for his career. He seems to have gone from this: To this: They really are scraping the barrel - not being funny, but Free Love Freeway is genuinely less parodic, and more memorable a tune, than the above at times. I despise him because he ruined The Verve, a genuinely great band, and ruined his own talent with his stinking attitude. It's not the kind of dislike for say, a band like Kasabian where it's always been loutish knobhead music written by loutish knobheads - Ashcroft genuinely had it all going for him at one time and it went all to his head. If he had any ounce of humility, he'd still be a great frontman in a great band, potentially still producing great songs at the inspiration of his bandmates. But his unbearable ego shot The Verve down, and I really pity all the immensely talented band members who had to put up with such a diva. A hellish waste of a good band. For him, he was the be all and end all and nobody else mattered. He's a joke figure now, writing joke music for himself while deluding himself that his stuff actually matters. Really is David Brent stuff. He also ruined the Urban Hymns 20th anniversary reissue by not allowing all those awesome demos. |
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Post by thuperthonic on Sept 13, 2021 9:02:44 GMT -5
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Post by thespiderandthefly on Sept 20, 2021 3:05:13 GMT -5
I usually like 1-2 songs per solo record these days, but in a world of dreadful pop music, I need RA to keeping chipping away at it.
Also, wasn’t he the main songwriter for the Verve? Or do I have that wrong? (Seeing many comments to the tune of 1+1=3 with the Verve guys, but solo-wise, many think the wheels have come off). Sorry, don’t know much of the history there…
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Post by Day Tripper on Sept 20, 2021 5:44:07 GMT -5
Also, wasn’t he the main songwriter for the Verve? Or do I have that wrong? (Seeing many comments to the tune of 1+1=3 with the Verve guys, but solo-wise, many think the wheels have come off). Sorry, don’t know much of the history there… Before Urban Hymns, I think the songwriting process was usually that Si Jones and Pete Salisbury would jam together on bass and drums, then McCabe did his guitar magic and when the instrumental had formed Richard would improvise lyrics and vocals. About half of the Urban Hymns was written by Richard on an acoustic though before the rest of the band touched them. |
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Post by quantum on Sept 20, 2021 6:01:32 GMT -5
Also, wasn’t he the main songwriter for the Verve? Or do I have that wrong? (Seeing many comments to the tune of 1+1=3 with the Verve guys, but solo-wise, many think the wheels have come off). Sorry, don’t know much of the history there… Before Urban Hymns, I think the songwriting process was usually that Si Jones and Pete Salisbury would jam together on bass and drums, then McCabe did his guitar magic and when the instrumental had formed Richard would improvise lyrics and vocals. About half of the Urban Hymns was written by Richard on an acoustic though before the rest of the band touched them. From what I remember, the band (minus Nick) were struggling in the studio with Urban Hymns so Richard was persuaded so bring back Nick. On returning, Nick reworked/tinkered with the majority of tracks and we ended up with the Urban Hymns we know. Fantastic writing by Richard, with stardust added by the rest of the group. However, once the album was acclaimed, Richard decided he was the genius, the band split up (again) and Richard signed a massive solo deal, which produced a few decent songs, but nothing to touch Urban Hymns. It seems the magic happens when they work together, but there are issues between Richard and a few of the others. |
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Post by Manualex on Sept 20, 2021 10:17:14 GMT -5
Before Urban Hymns, I think the songwriting process was usually that Si Jones and Pete Salisbury would jam together on bass and drums, then McCabe did his guitar magic and when the instrumental had formed Richard would improvise lyrics and vocals. About half of the Urban Hymns was written by Richard on an acoustic though before the rest of the band touched them. From what I remember, the band (minus Nick) were struggling in the studio with Urban Hymns so Richard was persuaded so bring back Nick. On returning, Nick reworked/tinkered with the majority of tracks and we ended up with the Urban Hymns we know. Fantastic writing by Richard, with stardust added by the rest of the group. However, once the album was acclaimed, Richard decided he was the genius, the band split up (again) and Richard signed a massive solo deal, which produced a few decent songs, but nothing to touch Urban Hymns. It seems the magic happens when they work together, but there are issues between Richard and a few of the others. Note worthy that most highlights of Richard sólo records were demoed by the verve before Urban Hymns |
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Post by glider on Sept 20, 2021 17:30:29 GMT -5
I usually like 1-2 songs per solo record these days, but in a world of dreadful pop music, I need RA to keeping chipping away at it. Also, wasn’t he the main songwriter for the Verve? Or do I have that wrong? (Seeing many comments to the tune of 1+1=3 with the Verve guys, but solo-wise, many think the wheels have come off). Sorry, don’t know much of the history there… Similar to how U2 created songs in their hay day - freeform, expansive jams with Bono singing whatever came to his mind, majority of the time it being just gibberish, working his way through the song and over a slow cook settling on a lyrical structure and trimming the fat. Verve worked this way as well, and was their brilliance, to create these massive soundscapes and have Richard bring a pop touch to each song and gave them an established identity. |
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Post by The Escapist on Sept 20, 2021 17:34:23 GMT -5
I usually like 1-2 songs per solo record these days, but in a world of dreadful pop music, I need RA to keeping chipping away at it. Also, wasn’t he the main songwriter for the Verve? Or do I have that wrong? (Seeing many comments to the tune of 1+1=3 with the Verve guys, but solo-wise, many think the wheels have come off). Sorry, don’t know much of the history there… Similar to how U2 created songs in their hay day - freeform, expansive jams with Bono singing whatever came to his mind, majority of the time it being just gibberish, working his way through the song and over a slow cook settling on a lyrical structure and trimming the fat. Verve worked this way as well, and was their brilliance, to create these massive soundscapes and have Richard bring a pop touch to each song and gave them an established identity. Was History the first song Richard mainly wrote on his own? Great song, but you can hear the start of his solo career there, if that's the case. Sort of thing that would have been severely out of place just a couple of years earlier on the debut. |
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Post by Day Tripper on Sept 20, 2021 19:25:33 GMT -5
From what I remember, the band (minus Nick) were struggling in the studio with Urban Hymns so Richard was persuaded so bring back Nick. On returning, Nick reworked/tinkered with the majority of tracks and we ended up with the Urban Hymns we know. Fantastic writing by Richard, with stardust added by the rest of the group. However, once the album was acclaimed, Richard decided he was the genius, the band split up (again) and Richard signed a massive solo deal, which produced a few decent songs, but nothing to touch Urban Hymns. It seems the magic happens when they work together, but there are issues between Richard and a few of the others. Note worthy that most highlights of Richard sólo records were demoed by the verve before Urban Hymns This is actually something I hadn't thought of. I've always liked his debut solo album and kinda thought he was still in the songwriting flow that we heard in UH but it would actually make a lot of sense that the best tracks in the album still had that Verve magic and were originally created with the band together. The finished product might not be the Verve but the arrangements have the other members' touch in them. |
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Post by glider on Sept 20, 2021 20:48:59 GMT -5
Similar to how U2 created songs in their hay day - freeform, expansive jams with Bono singing whatever came to his mind, majority of the time it being just gibberish, working his way through the song and over a slow cook settling on a lyrical structure and trimming the fat. Verve worked this way as well, and was their brilliance, to create these massive soundscapes and have Richard bring a pop touch to each song and gave them an established identity. Was History the first song Richard mainly wrote on his own? Great song, but you can hear the start of his solo career there, if that's the case. Sort of thing that would have been severely out of place just a couple of years earlier on the debut. See You In the Next One off the debut was his first official credited song. Drenched in an echoey piano reverb and acoustic compared to the sappy string arrangements he'd later use. On Your Own was his second song, then History. History was the band-altering song as Nick voluntarily didn't add any contributions to the album mix, and apparently Richard took offense to that. This all led to History being the band's final single (with the iconic "All Farewells Should Be Sudden" cover) in Sept.'95, breaking up afterwards. |
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Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5
Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5