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Post by tomlivesforever on Sept 6, 2011 11:32:35 GMT -5
Was it the crowd's lack of familiarity with the material or did the boys put on a lacklustre performance that night? They sounded decent but the songs didn't get the crowd going I was a the troxy and the Japanese Benefit gig, both were brilliant. Crowd and band. |
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Post by tomlivesforever on Sept 6, 2011 11:42:10 GMT -5
I had hoped for years that Liam would've cleaned up and put in the time to make Oasis great again, but he simply didn't give a crap. He was comfortable being who they were. Now he has something to prove that Noel is out of the picture and everyone looks to him as the leader if you will. He was never meant to be a leader. It is a bit sad, but that is what we have now. But I tend to agree that the tunes need to step it up to really showcase his new found enthusiasm. Blame Pettiness! He's led before, across the european tour in 2000 and he's doing a perfectly adequate job of it now. I don't really know what he's done to make you see different. And in regards to him not giving a crap in later day Oasis, I still take issue with this. I think he genuinely struggled to sing the songs that were originally recorded in his early 20's I don't think thats much of a revelation or a stretch to get that. A song like Roll With It for example was always going to be a struggle for him in the last few years. Think he would have had a problem with that in 02' tbh. |
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Post by pphillipsukuk on Sept 6, 2011 12:08:40 GMT -5
It's a long process, and it will take time. Beady Eye are having the Ian Brown after the Roses press at the moment. Noel is then golden boy and Liam is viewed as the ignorant younger brother. He just needs to keep going and keep the faith. I was at Leeds this year and the crowd and band played mega, festivals where always going to be hard with them leaving Oasis songs on the bench.
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Post by ctmazin on Sept 6, 2011 12:21:48 GMT -5
Was at the Toronto show and it was pretty lacklustre, to be honest, except for a handful of songs. And Toronto was/is the biggest Oasis town in North America, no question.
I think Beady Eye's problem is that apart from 4 Letter Word, their best songs aren't hard charging rockers. Hard for a crowd to get into all of these fairly unfamiliar midtempo/slow tunes, even if they're pretty good.
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Post by tomlivesforever on Sept 6, 2011 12:25:22 GMT -5
Think the crowds are different in north america to what they are here. Just like its different for an american band playing at home than it is in europe. Theres been some pretty mad crowds here for Beady Eye.
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Post by ctmazin on Sept 6, 2011 13:12:05 GMT -5
That doesn't really make sense to me. Toronto crowds went bananas for Oasis. And I've been in similar sized venues to see other British bands where the crowd went nuts.
Songs like TBGO and Millionaire and TMS and KFAD are among their best tracks, but they neither rock hard nor are they concert singalongs. REALLY tough to get a crowd going on mid-tempo tracks and ballads when they're not big hits.
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Post by tomlivesforever on Sept 6, 2011 13:43:30 GMT -5
Well i'm just saying that in England i've seen and heard some mad crowds at their gigs.
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Post by songbirdsally on Sept 6, 2011 13:57:16 GMT -5
I agree about the 'their best songs being mid temp ones' like TMS and Wigwam. Songs like that don't get a crowd going. However, they're epic, and I enjoyed hearing them live a lot. The drums on Wigwam are amazing!
Songs like The Roller, BTL and FLW do get the crowd going. Man of Misery and TOAK are good too.
I look forward to the next tour, after the 2nd album is out. If they can ceep the songs I mentionned above and add some new singles, it should be alright.
Remember that on festivals a lot of people that come and watch don't have the CD so they only recognise singles. Gigs are way better than festivals, especially for a new band.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Sept 7, 2011 11:58:49 GMT -5
Don't really think it has anything to do with Noel gaining momentum in the press now with his album on the horizon.
After all, I have tickets to see BDI for a second time in December, and I'm banking on getting tickets on Friday for Noel's visit in November. The two aren't mutually exclusive.
I do think that Beady Eye are starting to run out of momentum now. Is anyone really surprised at the fact that they are struggling to sell out their third (or whatever number it is) UK tour? It's starting to get a bit excessive and stale now. In fact, I doubt very much I would have bought tickets for them again had I not missed the last part of the show the first time round.
Playing mediocre songs to the Oasis fanbase who aren't familiar with the setlist, or to festival go-ers who are even less enthusiastic about that prospect doesn't help. I don't think their fan base will grow substantially, but I think they'll get better receptions at gigs and festivals as people become more familiar and they solidify their musical output with better quality songs in the future.
I also don't agree with the premise that Liam never tried with Oasis. I agree that it may have been taken for granted, but I don't doubt his commitment to the cause when he took to the stage every night.
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Post by Rolo on Sept 7, 2011 12:04:26 GMT -5
Don't really get what you're saying as both times I've been to see them, Wolverhampton especially, the crowd were mental, people had to be helped back up to their feet it got that crazy.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2011 12:21:24 GMT -5
It's cos the songs are about as exciting as a beer stained carpet.
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Post by starwillshine on Sept 7, 2011 12:56:37 GMT -5
It's cos the songs are about as exciting as a beer stained carpet. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz |
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Post by TheShakermaker on Sept 7, 2011 14:47:20 GMT -5
I dont see their fanbase growing with the next album. On the contrary. This album had most oasis fans buy it, because they are who they are. They can only lose that.
Of course, should they put out an amazing album, they would gain new fans. But let's be honest here. This is what they're capable of. Had they the capacity to write truly great songs, they would no doubt had used it for the first album, that had to prove them in their own right. I think the lack of selling out shows reflects this.
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Post by pphillipsukuk on Sept 7, 2011 15:22:57 GMT -5
To be honest this being the third tour in nine months and it being the same show/setlist will play more of a part in them not selling out than the strength of the songs themselves. And its pretty much fact that most of the songs on this album are left over Oasis songs, the judgement on what sort of album they can make should come after album number two when they bring a full set of new songs to the table. Last but not least fan base and popularity are very fickle, at the moment it's Noel's time so Beady Eye at the back end of the tour/promotional efforts for this album seem stale. We've had the tunes for eight months and everything Noel does is fresh and exciting.....fast forward to summer next year and BeadyEye will again be all over the media and fingers crossed making better decisions with their singles. Despite the negative feeling at the moment Liam Gallagher is still a big deal in the UK and if they knock out a great first single and get the promotion right the fan base will grow.
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Post by BlueJay on Sept 8, 2011 1:18:02 GMT -5
I also don't agree with the premise that Liam never tried with Oasis. I agree that it may have been taken for granted, but I don't doubt his commitment to the cause when he took to the stage every night. Getting drunk before the that V Festival performance that he pulled out of? Humiliating Noel by pulling out of MTV Unplugged in 1996 and barely showing up for the rehearsals? Turning up drunk/high/coked up for Knebworth, GMEX, Earls Court 1997, Wembley 2000 and hundreds of other shows? There's a bit of a lack of commitment there somewhere. It was funny in the 90s because he could still pull it off, but in the 2000s - especially on the DOYS tour - it severely affected his performances and that's where you have to quesion his commitment to the band. |
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Post by GIMH on Sept 8, 2011 1:50:55 GMT -5
Liam got drunk before gigs from day one. Did he never care? Of course he did. Liam bled Oasis.
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Post by GIMH on Sept 8, 2011 1:57:45 GMT -5
And Liam being drunk at Knebworth was one of the things that made it so special. If Liam wasn't like that, do you honestly think Oasis would have ever become a worldwide phenomenon?
Of course, his singing that night at Wembley in 2000 was horrid, but ask someone who was there what they thought of the gig. We can watch live(ish) on Sky One and think ugh, or listen/watch the bootleg years later and judge it but there were 80,000 people there that night, the bulk of whom probably had one of the best nights of their lives.
Not that that affects whether he cares or not, but if he stepped on stage it was because he wanted to. If he didn't care then he wouldn't bother (which at times he did of course, at which point maybe be was taking things for granted, but it was only ever for the odd gig).
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Post by psj3809 on Sept 8, 2011 3:33:11 GMT -5
Watching Beady Eye at the Gurten Festival, Liam blew me away and the band was on top form. But for what? The spotlight is on Noel and Beady Eye seem to be forgotten already. With Noel suddenly announcing his album and singles then obviously the spotlight is now on him and BDI are in the background. Go back a year or so and there was all the hype about Beady Eye, the name of the band, Bring the light, then their album, 30 sec clips of the songs and so on. Noels got the spotlight now as Beady Eye are coming to the end of their tour. Once Noels hype dies down a bit it'll be back to Beady Eye next year when their second album comes out in the summer (i presume after Noels/AA album). Its an important second album for Beady Eye, their first album surprised a few people but it hasnt had the huge huge hits to be honest. It seems mostly for hardcore Oasis fans not the general person down the street. They need a killer hit on the second album to break out into new audiences. Hope they get it I cant stand the crappy Noel vs Liam wars going on here, like a bunch of Take That fans arguing who the cutest one is. I'm gutted Oasis have split up but i'm loving all this music we're getting, next few months it'll be all Noel, then later next year back to BDI. If Oasis were still together they would probably release a new album once every 4 years, at the moment we're getting tons of great music. Liams singing really well, some great live performances we've seen, its all good |
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Post by space75gr on Sept 8, 2011 4:26:17 GMT -5
the spirit is here, stronger than ever
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Post by spaneli on Sept 8, 2011 9:09:15 GMT -5
I had hoped for years that Liam would've cleaned up and put in the time to make Oasis great again, but he simply didn't give a crap. He was comfortable being who they were. Now he has something to prove that Noel is out of the picture and everyone looks to him as the leader if you will. He was never meant to be a leader. It is a bit sad, but that is what we have now. But I tend to agree that the tunes need to step it up to really showcase his new found enthusiasm. Blame Pettiness! He's led before, across the european tour in 2000 and he's doing a perfectly adequate job of it now. I don't really know what he's done to make you see different. And in regards to him not giving a crap in later day Oasis, I still take issue with this. I think he genuinely struggled to sing the songs that were originally recorded in his early 20's I don't think thats much of a revelation or a stretch to get that. A song like Roll With It for example was always going to be a struggle for him in the last few years. Think he would have had a problem with that in 02' tbh. Is that really leading though? So Noel was gone for a few gigs and Oasis didn't go down in a ball of flames. Is that really leadership? Or is that just you having a loyal fanbase while you're still doing extremely well. Listen, my problem with Liam is that there really hasn't been a clear statement of intent. There's been no real plan. As much as Noel says that we never had a plan with Oasis, it all just came and we rolled with punches and so on, I still have a hard time believing him. I mean I don't think that there was totally no plan. That doesn't mean I think that he knew that he would Sheffield arena at a certain point or whatever, but there was a plan and a stated goal. The goal, the intent: to be the biggest band in the world. And I believe that Noel knew what it would take to do that, and it was widely understood by the band that they were going for that title. But with Liam and co, I really don't know what they want to do. What they want to be. I don't think that anyone knows. I think if I started a thread on what kind of band do you think Beady Eye is. I'd probably get a dozen different answers such, "they just want to release music", or" they're trying to build toward being somewhat commercially successful", or whatever. But the fact is that I don't think that anyone really knows what this band wants to do, and what it's purpose is. Do you just want to release albums and tour? Okay. You don't care about commercial success? Okay. Wait, you think that Beady Eye will be bigger than Oasis? And as big as the Beatles? Somehow that doesn't mix. And please don't say: "what do you expect him to say." because Noel can be just as brash, and yet he hasn't been. I guess I'm just saying that I think all the fans are in this cyclical process now. Where we're constantly going to be saying: "well, wait for the next song", "wait for the next album", "wait for the next tour". And the sad thing is, I think Beady Eye are also in that same cycle. I mean, at some point you have to decide what kind of band you want to be, and it has to be clear. Maybe not to us, but to at least people in the band. And I get the sense that it isn't so clear within the band, of what they want to be. Which is one of the hallmarks of leadership. It's having a message that everyone has agreed to follow, and you carrying on through with that message. And I just haven't seen that from Liam. |
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Post by ctmazin on Sept 8, 2011 9:40:19 GMT -5
Great post, spaneli. Part of the perceived disappointment with DGSS had to do with Liam's ridiculous predictions for Beady Eye's success.
Their best strategy would be part of what their doing. Become a hard-working, hard touring band that develops a strong core audience. Tour relentlessly. Connect with fans in whatever way possible. Take care of Liam's voice.
I think this is their ticket to the sort of strong, but not overwhelming success, they're capable of. The songwriting talent in the band is pretty good, but they're unlikely to have any big hits. They just need to grind it out, and enough people will buy their records and come to their shows. LAG just need to temper expectations.
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Post by TheShakermaker on Sept 8, 2011 12:28:37 GMT -5
Of course, his singing that night at Wembley in 2000 was horrid, but ask someone who was there what they thought of the gig. We can watch live(ish) on Sky One and think ugh, or listen/watch the bootleg years later and judge it but there were 80,000 people there that night, the bulk of whom probably had one of the best nights of their lives. I was there, and you're right, it was amazing. But not for the reason you think. We didnt hear Liam sing that night at all, the crowd drowned him out. The only vocals i heard from the stage was noel singing hey hey my my, because we didnt know the lyrics at that time. I only heard how awful Liam sounded some days later when the bootlegs surfaced. I do think Liam showed lack of respect with his behaviour that night. It was a huge thing for them to play wembley then, they had added an extra show, and the die hard fans who had been in line for tickets for a day or more, got to see Liam really not being able to sing a line at all. Liam ruined that night, the fans saved it. |
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Post by Rifles on Sept 8, 2011 13:35:32 GMT -5
How can anyone argue that Liam cared as much and tried as hard in Oasis' later years as he does in Beady Eye? That's insanity. tomlivesforever, you made the point of songs in Oasis were written when he was 20. That's why songs like Some Might Say were never heard of after 2002. That's why when they tried playing My Big Mouth on the last tour, they dropped it down to a lower key. They tried to accommodate his voice, but he wasn't putting in the effort.
Now in Beady Eye he magically sounds 10x better. You're trying to tell me it's because the songs are "written around his voice"? Come on now. He's singing in the same general register, and even higher in songs like For Anyone. The reason he sounds better is because he's taking better care of himself. He's not drinking as much, he's actually going to sound checks which i'm sure helps him to not feel like he needs to shout to be heard.
And good for him. I'm glad he sounds better. It's fucking great that we have an improved Liam out there singing songs. I hope he continues to improve and I hope their 2nd album blows the first one out of the water. I'd rather have both Gallaghers putting out music and touring than have an Oasis reunion tour and hear the same old songs again (although they would sound much better with Liam's current vocals).
I'm all for people defending Liam on most things because I think he gets the short end of the stick a lot, but when it comes to his voice, he has to take the lion's share of the blame.
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Post by BlueJay on Sept 9, 2011 2:12:53 GMT -5
But when it comes to his voice, he has to take the lion's share of the blame. |
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Post by lastfanstanding on Sept 9, 2011 3:53:48 GMT -5
Didnt he say he wanted to put out 2 albums then take a break then come back with an album back to back. Like 2 on then off then 2 on then off etc.
Liam HATED the 2- 3 year breaks in Oasis between albums.
But unless you have really good stuff then it's pointless to shove it down people's throats every year. Better to wait till you have a good collection of tunes.
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