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Post by themanwholivesinhell on Sept 9, 2021 5:30:22 GMT -5
I don't subscribe to this theory that Be Here Now, the Spice Girls popularity and Diana's death are all this binding narrative that meant the cool britania/britpop movement was destined for the end. It seems to a popular opinion amongst journalists like John Harris who just hate Oasis. If (and its obviously a big if) the next album was as good as Morning Glory they'd have carried on their dominance. One thing I will say is though, and it's commonly overlooked, Oasis are a band that people were waiting to see fail. Morning Glory got awful reviews. Its only because the songs were so undeniably popular that they back tracked. So Be Here Now was perfect to knock them down with, albeit months later when they were sure we all wouldn't love it like WTSMG. It certainly had nothing to do with the Spice Girls and sure as hell wasn't relatable to Diana's death. Ye i guess we’re kind of partly in agreement. I was too young to remember, but like you I don’t really buy the theory that Diana’s death depressed the whole nation and killed a feel-good era on its own. It was a tragic shock I’m sure, but I think its aftereffect has been exaggerated since. I also totally get that the press never fully warmed to Oasis; the ridiculous initial acclaim BHN got was basically responding to how they got MG wrong. And on the other hand, I don’t feel it deserved the later beatings they gave it (like The Great Escape, it was overrated then underrated). I guess there’s endless “what if” theories with BHN and how things would’ve gone had it been as good as MG. Like you say it’s a huge “if”, but sadly I feel that it even if it was better, they were never going to recapture the heights of 1996. As looking back, with MG going 12x platinum within a year and all the gig attendance/demand records, no rock act had really had a year so big since The Beatles (at least in the UK). They came about at the right time with the right album. I personally think BHN being as good would have kept them at the very top for 1-2 yrs longer, but not as big as they’d been. Still, just my take.
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Post by vespa on Sept 9, 2021 6:33:32 GMT -5
They didn’t need the American tour it burnt them out and on stateside diminished there massive hype train over there and put them back to indie status . They needed rest bite and be here now needed recording properly , if you strip that album back to morning glory style mixing and production the album would’ve kept them there it’s not the songs it’s the production of them but still a great album. The Diana death killed the mood of the nation especially in uk where oasis were culturally massive.. I sometimes think people don’t realise just how big they were from start of 95 till about 98 they were absolutely massive , and that not just uk round the world . Just because they weren’t playing stadiums worldwide didn’t mean they couldn’t , they were just blitzing gigs and the costs were still cheap. Look in Japan etc there sales to the very end are massive, they were a huge band on every scale, sales , hype, gigs , merchandise the lot
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Post by themanwholivesinhell on Sept 11, 2021 16:06:39 GMT -5
Its truly debatable, but it’s my opinion that Diana's death didn't permanently destroy the feel-good factor of Britain like many say. It certainly had a knock-back effect on our optimism, but I personally feel it wasn't terminal.
That theory about people always waiting for them to fail is certainly a good point, as with basically every post-BHN release critics missed some of their strengths because they were too busy moaning that it didn't resemble their best work.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Sept 11, 2021 18:35:11 GMT -5
No.
The ridiculousness of 1990s Oasis is what made the band special. Wouldn’t trade the Oasis story for anything.
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Post by carl80 on Sept 12, 2021 8:11:43 GMT -5
No cause then we wouldn’t have got Be Here Now, they can reflect and say what they want now but they where never going to take a break at that time.
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Post by liamg4life on Sept 12, 2021 19:32:55 GMT -5
Maybe not five years, but I do feel Be Here Now was released at the wrong time. I think it should've been in Summer/Autumn '96 to follow Knebworth (like Owen Morris suggested) when they were still untouchable, or otherwise waited til around late '98. Basically, Be Here Now didn’t singlehandedly kill feel-good Britpop like some say; by mid-'97 it had already peaked. Things were changing; with OK Computer and Urban Hymns, high-charting rock shifted to a more melancholy and less accessible sound. Hence full-on mainstream pop moved toward teen/dance acts like the Spice Girls and Backstreet Boys. In the UK at least, that 94-97 era basically was the last time that rock totally was the mainstream pop genre, rather than just being a part of the mainstream. If Be Here Now had equalled Oasis’ earlier albums, it might have prolonged Britpop for perhaps a year, but the end was inevitable. Ive often said that Blur were somewhat lucky, in that they had their BHN-type “comedown” earlier with The Great Escape in 95-96. Overrated by critics on release and sold well, but by Summer '96 most agreed it wasn't as good as Parklife. Which then enabled them to make their big change with Blur in early '97; before Britpop ended . And that change basically saved their artistic credibility. I think if Oasis had waited til late '98 to put out Be Here Now, even they would have realised a need to update their sound. It would have been better-produced, and have a better general reputation. Also, they'd have avoided that reputation they seemed to have outside the fanbase from around 1999-2004, which was that of a relic from a past era trying to recreate their two great albums. As a kid whose friends all liked whatever was hip, I remember it was with Don't Believe The Truth that they started to regain some mainstream credibility, as they evolved into more of a classic alt-rock band. This. Be Here Now likely would have been everything we know minus Magic Pie and plus Stay Young and The Fame. It would have been a much better received album (by the fans).
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Post by GlastoEls on Sept 13, 2021 2:36:23 GMT -5
Maybe not five years, but I do feel Be Here Now was released at the wrong time. I think it should've been in Summer/Autumn '96 to follow Knebworth (like Owen Morris suggested) when they were still untouchable, or otherwise waited til around late '98. Basically, Be Here Now didn’t singlehandedly kill feel-good Britpop like some say; by mid-'97 it had already peaked. Things were changing; with OK Computer and Urban Hymns, high-charting rock shifted to a more melancholy and less accessible sound. Hence full-on mainstream pop moved toward teen/dance acts like the Spice Girls and Backstreet Boys. In the UK at least, that 94-97 era basically was the last time that rock totally was the mainstream pop genre, rather than just being a part of the mainstream. If Be Here Now had equalled Oasis’ earlier albums, it might have prolonged Britpop for perhaps a year, but the end was inevitable. Ive often said that Blur were somewhat lucky, in that they had their BHN-type “comedown” earlier with The Great Escape in 95-96. Overrated by critics on release and sold well, but by Summer '96 most agreed it wasn't as good as Parklife. Which then enabled them to make their big change with Blur in early '97; before Britpop ended . And that change basically saved their artistic credibility. I think if Oasis had waited til late '98 to put out Be Here Now, even they would have realised a need to update their sound. It would have been better-produced, and have a better general reputation. Also, they'd have avoided that reputation they seemed to have outside the fanbase from around 1999-2004, which was that of a relic from a past era trying to recreate their two great albums. As a kid whose friends all liked whatever was hip, I remember it was with Don't Believe The Truth that they started to regain some mainstream credibility, as they evolved into more of a classic alt-rock band. Yep.
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Post by quantum on Sept 13, 2021 5:35:08 GMT -5
I don't subscribe to this theory that Be Here Now, the Spice Girls popularity and Diana's death are all this binding narrative that meant the cool britania/britpop movement was destined for the end. It seems to a popular opinion amongst journalists like John Harris who just hate Oasis. If (and its obviously a big if) the next album was as good as Morning Glory they'd have carried on their dominance. One thing I will say is though, and it's commonly overlooked, Oasis are a band that people were waiting to see fail. Morning Glory got awful reviews. Its only because the songs were so undeniably popular that they back tracked. So Be Here Now was perfect to knock them down with, albeit months later when they were sure we all wouldn't love it like WTSMG. It certainly had nothing to do with the Spice Girls and sure as hell wasn't relatable to Diana's death. Ye i guess we’re kind of partly in agreement. I was too young to remember, but like you I don’t really buy the theory that Diana’s death depressed the whole nation and killed a feel-good era on its own. It was a tragic shock I’m sure, but I think its aftereffect has been exaggerated since. I also totally get that the press never fully warmed to Oasis; the ridiculous initial acclaim BHN got was basically responding to how they got MG wrong. And on the other hand, I don’t feel it deserved the later beatings they gave it (like The Great Escape, it was overrated then underrated). I guess there’s endless “what if” theories with BHN and how things would’ve gone had it been as good as MG. Like you say it’s a huge “if”, but sadly I feel that it even if it was better, they were never going to recapture the heights of 1996. As looking back, with MG going 12x platinum within a year and all the gig attendance/demand records, no rock act had really had a year so big since The Beatles (at least in the UK). They came about at the right time with the right album. I personally think BHN being as good would have kept them at the very top for 1-2 yrs longer, but not as big as they’d been. Still, just my take. I remember listening to leaked low quality mp3s of various BHN songs in the summer '97, and feeling disappointed. AATW and IGBM were poor, and Noel had overhyped Magic Pie... Replacing the above 3 songs with Stay Young, The Fame and Flashbax would have massively improved the album, but I doubt it would have touched WTSMG for popularity.
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Post by tiger40 on Sept 13, 2021 12:36:20 GMT -5
I think that (I Got) The Fever and My Sister Lover (despite what some people think of it would have improved Be Here Now drastically.
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