|
|
Post by garylineker on Feb 6, 2021 3:31:15 GMT -5
Hypothetical game here. Let's say Noel didn't go down the lazy route of asking the rest of the band for their best songs, just so he didn't have to write as many or stockpile for a solo album. How many Liam, Andy and Gem songs would actually have made the cut?
Just to stop the inevitable "non cos they're all shit" replies, you have to compare them to the b-sides Noel made for each era. So Hung In A Bad Place Vs Shout It Out Loud for instance. Or swap LAG songs around.
I think every Noel b-side from SOTSOG and HC is better than all the LAG album efforts bar Songbird. He didn't do particularly many b-sides for DBTT so I'd keep that the same but maybe put Eyeball Tickler on record for KTDA. DOYS was remix central so can't really compare. Boy with The Blues and I Believe In All should make it though over Ain't Got Nothin and Nature Of Reality.
So
Songbird
Turn Up The Sun
Eyeball Tickler
A Bell Will Ring
I'm Outta Time
Soldier On
Boy With The Blues
I Believe In All
8. Not many for 7 years worth, just shows how much was sacrificed just to let it feel more of a team effort. The albums were always the be all and end all in terms of critical reception and any perceived comeback. So it's a shame so much was wasted.
|
|
|
|
Post by beentherenow on Feb 6, 2021 5:00:29 GMT -5
It’s the thing that winds me up most about the ‘songwriting democracy’ of their last three albums. It was just so formulaic regardless of quality.
Take great bands like The Beatles and Pink Floyd, they had multiple songwriters but it was whoever brought the most to the table for each particular album which got chosen. Harrison might have 3 on one album but only 1 on another for example.
Oasis regardless of quality had 3 by Liam and 1 from the other two (except DBTT where Andy got 2). Take DOYS for example, no way on earth should Nature of Reality been chosen. If that is Andy’s best effort then he doesn’t get a song on the album. Whereas Gem’s To Be Where’s There’s Life fully justifies its place. It should have been fluid. The Band meet up prior to going into the studio and present all their songs and the best songs regardless of who’s written them are chosen. If 10 are Noel’s, with only 1 or 2 from the others, it shouldn’t matter that’s the album.
|
|
|
|
Post by tomlivesforever on Feb 6, 2021 5:50:14 GMT -5
I know I’m boring about this but it’s time we stopped the myth of democracy for democracies sake. Noel didn’t have the songs or not the songs he was willing to put on an Oasis record.
I think it also does Andy and Gem a big disservice. I reckon if those lads sat in the studio and listened to Noel playing an absolute banger they would be saying it has to go on there, even at a cost of one of their own.
|
|
|
|
Post by andymorris on Feb 6, 2021 6:08:38 GMT -5
Songbird BOADC I'm Outta Time Boy With The Blues Turn Up the Sun To Be Where’s There Pass Me Down the Wine That's about it. At least for the song we know about. Compared to other songs Noel put on bsides or saved. Take great bands like The Beatles and Pink Floyd, they had multiple songwriters but it was whoever brought the most to the table for each particular album which got chosen. Harrison might have 3 on one album but only 1 on another for example. this is not entirely true though. Harrison had pretty much all of All Things Must Pass written in 68/69 and many of those songs were rejected in favor of Lennon / Macca songs during Abbey Road / Let It Be sessions. The Beatles worked the same as Oasis. They opened to Harrison just enough to keep him on board. Dont know about Pink Floyd though, i'm not into that band. |
|
|
|
Post by defmaybe00 on Feb 6, 2021 6:21:35 GMT -5
I know I’m boring about this but it’s time we stopped the myth of democracy for democracies sake. Noel didn’t have the songs or not the songs he was willing to put on an Oasis record. I think it also does Andy and Gem a big disservice. I reckon if those lads sat in the studio and listened to Noel playing an absolute banger they would be saying it has to go on there, even at a cost of one of their own. I don't think they are contradictory statements I believe Noel didn't have enough material (or finished material) because he was focusing on getting exactly those 2-3 singles worthy songs, 2-3 solid album tracks and that was it He imposed that scheme on himself, so that's what he brought in by the time they were getting into the studio to work It was the logical step for HC because he was clearly in a big slump, but after that he should've been a bit more flexible with the whole thing And I mean it also as I don't think we needed at least 1 song each, The Nature Of Reality shouldn't have made it on DOYS even if it means replacing it with a Liam written song (Boys With The Blues), same goes for A Bell Will Ring |
|
|
|
Post by Flashbax on Feb 6, 2021 7:16:26 GMT -5
Little James
- This song get way to much hate on here, maybe not the best lyrics, but Liam's first song and it sounds great. It fits the album, way better than Put Yer Money and I Can See a Liar.
Songbird
Born on a Different Cloud
- Good single and BOADC would have been a great song if it was better recorded (like most of HC). Way better than All in the Mind.
Turn up the Sun
Love Like a Bomb (Better recording)
Guess God Thinks I'm Abel
Eyeball Tickler
- DBTT shouldn't have these 4 songs by LAG on it, but they are alright if one or maybe 1 or 2 were on the album. I can't get my head around it how A Bell Will Ring ended up on DBTT.
I'm Outta Time
To Be Where There's Life
Boy with the Blues
- Would love to know why Noel chose Ain't Got Notin' and The Nature or Reality on DOYS.
|
|
|
|
Post by tomlivesforever on Feb 6, 2021 8:12:36 GMT -5
Songbird BOADC I'm Outta Time Boy With The Blues Turn Up the Sun To Be Where’s There Pass Me Down the Wine That's about it. At least for the song we know about. Compared to other songs Noel put on bsides or saved. Take great bands like The Beatles and Pink Floyd, they had multiple songwriters but it was whoever brought the most to the table for each particular album which got chosen. Harrison might have 3 on one album but only 1 on another for example. this is not entirely true though. Harrison had pretty much all of All Things Must Pass written in 68/69 and many of those songs were rejected in favor of Lennon / Macca songs during Abbey Road / Let It Be sessions. The Beatles worked the same as Oasis. They opened to Harrison just enough to keep him on board. Dont know about Pink Floyd though, i'm not into that band. I think compromising to keep Harrison on board is a little different to Andy and Gem. |
|
|
|
Post by The Crimson Rambler on Feb 6, 2021 9:00:19 GMT -5
SOTSOG (LAG)
Lyrics aside 'Little James' decent b-side from Liam but it shouldn't have been on the album. It doesn't deserve some of the hate it gets though.
Heathen Chemistry (LAG)
- Hung In a Bad Place
- Songbird
- A Quick Peep
- Born On a Different Cloud
- The Roller
All of these songs were worth considering for the album IMO because Noel just didn't have the tunes. 'Idler's Dream', 'Revolution Song' and 'Let there Be Love' were strong enough but the Liam/Noel balance would be out of whack as 'Force of Nature', 'Little by Little' and 'She Is Love' already correctly occupy the Noel sung spots. Ideally Liam would've sung these a few of these but from what I've read and can hear I don't think he physically could. '(Probably) All In the Mind' and 'Better Man' shouldn't have been on the album and I'd have been hesitant to even release them as b-sides. IMO there is no possible combination of songs with the correct Noel/Liam ratio available to make what I consider a strong Oasis album.
DBTT (LAG)
- Turn Up the Sun
- Love Like a Bomb
- The Meaning of Soul
- Guess God Thinks I'm Abel
- Keep the Dream Alive
- The Boy with the Blues*
- Soldier On*
- The Roller
An alright batch from team LAG. 'The Meaning of Soul' isn't the strongest but deserves consideration simply because it's change of pace. I'm not sure how different 'The Boy with the Blues' or 'Soldier On' sounded in comparison with the released versions but if they were in that kind of ballpark in terms of quality they should have been in consideration, though you could argue stylistically they aren't the best match. Ideally a Liam sung 'Record Machine' should've made the album as should 'Stop the Clocks' though another Noel sung song would've been overkill. Maybe 'Lord Don't Slow Me Down' (with an additional verse) and 'WPTWOTWOMS' should've made the album too though the latter doesn't fit too well. Ultimately the only track I'd say they definitely made a mistake including was 'A Bell Will Ring'.
DOYS (LAG)
- I'm Outta Time
- To Be Where There's Life
- Soldier On
- The Boy with the Blues
'The Boy with the Blues' is a decent song but it's at odds with 'Soldier On' in closing the album IMO and the latter shades it. 'Ain't Got Nothin'' and 'The Nature of Reality' are ok (and don't deserve the hate they get) but it's unacceptable to include them when you've got 2 songs Liam could've sung in 'Record Machine' and 'Come On Outside' waiting on the bench. 'High Horse Lady' is b-side gear and too should've been dropped.
So to summarise 'Little James', 'Better Man', 'A Bell Will Ring', 'Ain't Got Nothin'' and 'The Nature of Reality' are the LAG songs that definitely should've been dropped. Sure, there's a few maybes on HC and DBTT but these are the 5 I feel strongly about removing.
In terms of LAG highlights I'd say 'Songbird', 'Turn Up the Sun', 'I'm Outta Time', 'To Be Where There's Life', 'Soldier On' and 'The Boy with the Blues' are the best of the bunch.
|
|
|
|
Post by matt on Feb 6, 2021 9:43:40 GMT -5
I know I’m boring about this but it’s time we stopped the myth of democracy for democracies sake. Noel didn’t have the songs or not the songs he was willing to put on an Oasis record. I think it also does Andy and Gem a big disservice. I reckon if those lads sat in the studio and listened to Noel playing an absolute banger they would be saying it has to go on there, even at a cost of one of their own.I wonder how much writing credits played a part in this. Although they probably knew Noel has much better songs, they might not be willing to forego their own song at the risk of losing out on a bit more cash? (I'm not sure how much a writing credit is worth on an album?). |
|
|
|
Post by andymorris on Feb 6, 2021 11:39:02 GMT -5
Songbird BOADC I'm Outta Time Boy With The Blues Turn Up the Sun To Be Where’s There Pass Me Down the Wine That's about it. At least for the song we know about. Compared to other songs Noel put on bsides or saved. this is not entirely true though. Harrison had pretty much all of All Things Must Pass written in 68/69 and many of those songs were rejected in favor of Lennon / Macca songs during Abbey Road / Let It Be sessions. The Beatles worked the same as Oasis. They opened to Harrison just enough to keep him on board. Dont know about Pink Floyd though, i'm not into that band. I think compromising to keep Harrison on board is a little different to Andy and Gem. Well in the context of each band, no. Harrison is seen as a very important member now, but back then, he wasn't very important to Paul and John. They just needed a good guitar player and favored their tunes first, bar the very obvious one that couldn't possibly get rejected. But with two songs with the same level, Paul and George went for theirs every time. Maybe his input is regarded as crucial nowadays, but in the 60s, Harrison was just that guy behind the two main guys. Just like Andy and Gem. It's not an historian quote but it represents well what John and Paul thought of George at the time www.quora.com/What-did-John-Lennon-and-Paul-McCartney-think-of-George-Harrisons-solo-work-after-the-breakup-Were-they-kicking-themselves-for-not-allowing-him-to-write-moreAnd www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/why-john-lennon-and-paul-mccartney-treated-george-harrison-like-a-lesser-beatle.html/Regardes of song quality, it's the same thing really. Keeping a band together while not threatening their power. Exactly what Noel did. |
|
|
|
Post by underneaththesky on Feb 6, 2021 11:55:44 GMT -5
all will be brand old
|
|
|
|
Post by tiger40 on Feb 6, 2021 14:24:52 GMT -5
Heathen Chemistry
Hung In A Bad Place
Songbird
Thankyou For The Good Times
Born On A Different Cloud
Don't Believe The Truth
Turn Up The Sun
Eye Ball Tickler
The Meaning Of Soul
Pass Me Down The Wine
Guess God Thinks I'm Able
Keep The Dream Alive
Dig Out Your Soul
Four Letter Word
I'm Outta Time (remix version)
To Be Where There's Life
Soldier On
I Believe In All
|
|
|
|
Post by defmaybe00 on Feb 6, 2021 14:52:01 GMT -5
If I had to go off pure quality:
Songbird
Born On A Different Cloud
Turn Up The Sun
Guess God Thinks I'm Abel
I'm Outta Time
Soldier On
Boy With The Blues
The ones left out:
Little James - I hate it, I'm not gonna hide
I've often spoken about how I can't stand songs that are *too* straightforward, this is a classic example of it
It was Liam's first proper song and you can totally hear, there's just no work besides the initial idea
Now, ICSAL and PYMWYMI are also awful, and LAMB and OWR should've been on the album, I think the other b-sides are b-sides material, but I'd be okay with Full On or Cigarettes In Hell in place of it
Better Man, Hung In A Bad Place, A Quick Peep - get rid of A Quick Peep, don't replace it, it's just useless
Replace HIABP with Idler's Dream and try to make it fit into the tracklist as one is a lovely piece of music with some of Noel's best lyrics and the other is a rock n roll parody
Replace Better Man with Shout It Out Loud, Better Man is awful, drags on while nothinf truly happens, Shout It Out Loud is middle of the pack for Noel but still a nice tune, use BOADC as a closer for the record
Keep The Dream Alive, The Meaning Of Soul, A Bell Will Ring, Love Like A Bomb - now this is tricky because I don't rate the DBTT b-sides at all. The only one I think is quite acceptable is Sittin Here In Silence, and there was Who Put The Weight... which never got a release, but they'd both turn the whole thing into a Noel solo record with occasional guests
In a world where nothing else was written around that time I guess make it a 10 tracks record and throw away A Bell Will Ring, maybe put Lord Don't Slow Me Down on it instead of The Meaning Of Soul
Keep The Dream Alive is cheesy as fuck and a bit Oasis by the numbers, but chorus is catchy and Noel rates it highly
Love Like A Bomb is a bad remake of Bob Dylan, but at least it's better than The Meaning Of Soul
Stop The Clocks was floating around, but then you'd have had to take off Let There Be Love and I really like it
Ain't Got Nothing and The Nature Of Reality - two songs I wish I'd never heard in my life
Change the tracklist, move one of the early rock numbers down and put Boy With The Blues in there somewhere
Record Come On Outside or Record Machine properly and get them on the album too
To Be Where There's Life - record it like the live version and we speak
|
|
Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5
Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5