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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Jan 5, 2018 20:17:01 GMT -5
I'm a football purist and traditionalist, so I vote NO. Goal-line technology, heh. Fair enough. But I feel VAR is a step too far. What are we going to do, make this more and more like American Football? Challenging plays, breaking up the fluidity? You don't want a 'perfect' sport. It takes the fun away. The more perfect the game becomes, the less talking points and controversies there will be, which is part of the sport in the first place! Train referees to become better - the standards at the moment in the PL are indeed shocking. Clarify the rules - what is offside? What constitutes as a handball? etc. But VAR? Fuck that shit.
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Post by Frank Lee Vulgar on Jan 6, 2018 8:38:02 GMT -5
We have it in the Bundesliga, and honestly I really like having it around. Sometimes it takes a few minutes for a decision which sucks, but they'll get better at it with more experience, and most of the time it really takes away the frustration when you immediately see in the replay that the ref was wrong.
And I never got the "it's part of the fun" argument at all. Seeing your favorite team lose because the ref fucked up is not fun. Even seeing your team win because of a mistake isn't great because it's all that people talk about.
VAR isn't perfect but most of the time it just takes away a completely random component, and the sport is good enough not to need a completely random component to be fun.
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Post by funhouse on Jan 8, 2018 17:29:46 GMT -5
No. When the system itself and the guidelines have been fully developed, the question should be asked. But as of now, it only leads to more confusion than there was before. Like in Italy, where some calls are revoked because of something that happened long before the situation that is being investigated, while clear handballs in the penalty area pass by unchecked. The referees don't know how to properly use this technology yet, which leads to inconsistency. Inconsistencies that contradict the entire point with VAR being installed. Some day the system will be ready for it, and so will the referees, but that day is not today. Go back to the lab and come back when you're done, but until then football will be better off without it.
Edit: I dont know how it's been working in Germany, but if they can achieve some kind of consistency over there I have less of a problem with it, despite interrupting the flow of the game and so on. I'm for a fairer game. But not if it ends up like in Italy, then it is pointless.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Jan 8, 2018 18:53:29 GMT -5
I’m not yet a strong proponent of VAR, but how is it fair to use VAR in the 4th round of the FA Cup but not the earlier rounds?
Either use it throughout the entire competition or don’t use it at all. It’s vastly inconsistent and that inconsistency has consequences. I don’t get it.
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Post by glio on Jan 8, 2018 19:23:39 GMT -5
I’m not yet a strong proponent of VAR, but how is it fair to use VAR in the 4th round of the FA Cup but not the earlier rounds? Either use it throughout the entire competition or don’t use it at all. It’s vastly inconsistent and that inconsistency has consequences. I don’t get it. to be fair in tennis, not all the courts have the challenge hawkeye system. only the show courts. its a money thing so there will be some inconsistency
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Jan 10, 2018 21:55:04 GMT -5
VAR is poor, poor, poor.
Just watched my first match with VAR implemented - Chelsea 0-0 Arsenal League Cup Semi Final First Leg
Slows the game down drastically.
Over 1 minute waiting to check the Welbeck challenge in the box, which was clearly no penalty. VAR is such a waste of time.
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Post by Manualex on Jan 10, 2018 22:02:17 GMT -5
VAR is poor, poor, poor. Just watched my first match with VAR implemented - Chelsea 0-0 Arsenal League Cup Semi Final First Leg Slows the game down drastically. Over 1 minute waiting to check the Welbeck challenge in the box, which was clearly no penalty. VAR is such a waste of time. It's the way it's implemented in football that slows down way too much. VAR should be watching alternate angles and say to the ear piece of the ref if it was a foul or not. No need of a small screen for the referee to watch it if it's unsure, that's the job of the var.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Jan 11, 2018 1:33:57 GMT -5
The great thing about English Football is the pace - there is so much fluidity.
One of the main things I hate about American Football (other than it simply being American) is all the fucking stoppages. Challenged plays - which is the same thing as VAR. Time outs. Etc. It turns a 90 minute sport into a 3 hour game - you’re mostly watching commercials! It’s so pathetic.
And after VAR where does it go?
I’ve heard shit like Sin Bins for English football. And adding a 39th match over in the United States. What drugs are people smoking?
The 2022 World Cup - corrupt and poorly thought out as it is - played in the winter?
Behave. Leave the sport alone.
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Post by RocketMan on Jan 11, 2018 9:09:41 GMT -5
The great thing about English Football is the pace - there is so much fluidity. One of the main things I hate about American Football (other than it simply being American) is all the fucking stoppages. Challenged plays - which is the same thing as VAR. Time outs. Etc. It turns a 90 minute sport into a 3 hour game - you’re mostly watching commercials! It’s so pathetic. And after VAR where does it go? I’ve heard shit like Sin Bins for English football. And adding a 39th match over in the United States. What drugs are people smoking? The 2022 World Cup - corrupt and poorly thought out as it is - played in the winter? Behave. Leave the sport alone. i think the money that is coming out of the premier league hurts football way more than the VAR. so don't be so dramatic. just wait until 4rsenal gets a penalty because of the VAR and you will love it
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Post by daviesh on Jan 11, 2018 12:17:01 GMT -5
Being in the stadium last night for VAR was an awful experience. There is zero communications with the crowd when it's happening, you can just see the ref put his finger to his ear and everyone else stop.
No idea what they are checking, what the outcome was or how long it will take!
As Beady rightly says, the PL has always been about fast football. VAR is by now means fast, and slows the momentum of the game. Also refs can, in the future become lazy and not make a decision, and just depend on VAR.
I think we need to improve on the shocking ref decision that often spoil a game, but VAR needs greater implementation to communicate to the crowd what's happening.
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Post by Let It Bleed on Jan 11, 2018 12:18:50 GMT -5
¿Do you want eva in the Premier League? Gracias.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Jan 18, 2018 1:41:51 GMT -5
Chelsea are fuming about VAR after their FA Cup win vs. Norwich. (How it’s wasn’t consulted after Willian’s purported dive, see below).
I’m not saying Willian dived, but it was not a penalty. Behave.
But Chelsea are indeed diving cheats. And both Pedro AND Morata got booked for dives in the area in that same match. Pedro’s especially was fucking shameful. (And both were eventually sent off, too lol).
Pedro’s -
Morata’s -
But back on topic, VAR is fucking idiotic. Get it the fuck out of football. And Chelsea are an utter disgrace.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Jan 29, 2018 19:01:34 GMT -5
This.
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Post by supernovadragon on Jan 30, 2018 3:16:06 GMT -5
Got up too early this morning so I ended up watching Sunday Suppliment on Youtube and all of them was so in unison about how it's going to save the game etc etc that it bored me. Sure it may help, in the future, problem is, why does the referee have to go and watch it on a separete screen even AFTER the help he's gotten from whoever it was telling him the decision. How hard is it? One person, upstairs somewhere watching it on a TV live, tells the ref straight away what the decision is. Done within about 30 seconds or so. Saturday was bloody rediculous!
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Post by sgtpeppr on Jan 30, 2018 3:40:38 GMT -5
its sh!te. itll never be fast/smooth enough to integrate well into the game, but even if they manage to speed it all up, there will still be errors, so whats the point?
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Post by tomlivesforever on Jan 30, 2018 4:20:32 GMT -5
I'm all for it personally and I think there are a few things people don't get about it. Its not going to eliminate all errors but should get rid of all the howlers and should reduce stuff like diving which in my opinion has ruined the game much more than VAR ever could.
It needs work, they need to show the fans what the VAR is looking at and they need the refferee to give the VAR a soft signal for example, The ref say's 'I think this is a penalty, have you got any evidence to overturn it'. This stops the whole responsibility being with the VAR they don't have to decide whether it was or wasn't just if the refs call was reasonable.
It will get better and quicker if they do it right. Its been great for other sports.
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Post by sgtpeppr on Jan 30, 2018 6:09:57 GMT -5
I'm all for it personally and I think there are a few things people don't get about it. Its not going to eliminate all errors but should get rid of all the howlers and should reduce stuff like diving which in my opinion has ruined the game much more than VAR ever could. It needs work, they need to show the fans what the VAR is looking at and they need the refferee to give the VAR a soft signal for example, The ref say's 'I think this is a penalty, have you got any evidence to overturn it'. This stops the whole responsibility being with the VAR they don't have to decide whether it was or wasn't just if the refs call was reasonable. It will get better and quicker if they do it right. Its been great for other sports.other sports that use it are filled with stoppages anyway, so its no matter if you gotta wait a couple of minutes for a decision. the clock dont stop in football, so depending on how it evolves, we could end up with 15 minute injury times. im also not convinced that it will actually get better/quicker. it all depends on which direction they take it...
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Post by supernovadragon on Jan 30, 2018 6:59:40 GMT -5
I'm all for it personally and I think there are a few things people don't get about it. Its not going to eliminate all errors but should get rid of all the howlers and should reduce stuff like diving which in my opinion has ruined the game much more than VAR ever could. It needs work, they need to show the fans what the VAR is looking at and they need the refferee to give the VAR a soft signal for example, The ref say's 'I think this is a penalty, have you got any evidence to overturn it'. This stops the whole responsibility being with the VAR they don't have to decide whether it was or wasn't just if the refs call was reasonable. It will get better and quicker if they do it right. Its been great for other sports.other sports that use it are filled with stoppages anyway, so its no matter if you gotta wait a couple of minutes for a decision. the clock dont stop in football, so depending on how it evolves, we could end up with 15 minute injury times. im also not convinced that it will actually get better/quicker. it all depends on which direction they take it... Which brings Alan Pardew's point into question at weekend when he said that he had lost 2 players due to hamstring injures. Could the problem get worse?
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Post by RocketMan on Jan 30, 2018 10:45:59 GMT -5
Got up too early this morning so I ended up watching Sunday Suppliment on Youtube and all of them was so in unison about how it's going to save the game etc etc that it bored me. Sure it may help, in the future, problem is, why does the referee have to go and watch it on a separete screen even AFTER the help he's gotten from whoever it was telling him the decision. How hard is it? One person, upstairs somewhere watching it on a TV live, tells the ref straight away what the decision is. Done within about 30 seconds or so. Saturday was bloody rediculous! thats the biggest issue to me. they want the referee on the field to make the calls which is pretty stupid. they should just give the VAR the final call and whatever he decides should be announced to everybody in the stadium to understand, so theres no confusion anymore. just like at the confed cup or in the NFL.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Jan 30, 2018 17:10:57 GMT -5
I'm all for it personally and I think there are a few things people don't get about it. Its not going to eliminate all errors but should get rid of all the howlers and should reduce stuff like diving which in my opinion has ruined the game much more than VAR ever could. It needs work, they need to show the fans what the VAR is looking at and they need the refferee to give the VAR a soft signal for example, The ref say's 'I think this is a penalty, have you got any evidence to overturn it'. This stops the whole responsibility being with the VAR they don't have to decide whether it was or wasn't just if the refs call was reasonable. It will get better and quicker if they do it right. Its been great for other sports.other sports that use it are filled with stoppages anyway, so its no matter if you gotta wait a couple of minutes for a decision. the clock dont stop in football, so depending on how it evolves, we could end up with 15 minute injury times. im also not convinced that it will actually get better/quicker. it all depends on which direction they take it... Yeah, it's Americanzing the sport in the sense that English Football will now be filled with all the stoppages that ruin American Football. And it really won't be long until advertisements get involved with VAR and we'll start having commercial breaks for every VAR decision. Soon there will be timeouts and shite like that. Remember, there's a cohort who have been pressing for both "Sin Bins" as well as an extra 39th game played in the US. All these "improvements" are destroying/will destroy the sport. Also, what the fuck was the point of changing the kick-off rule this season? It worked just fine tapping it to your teammate in the centre-circle. I don't get change for change's sake, either. Fucking hell.
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Post by supernovadragon on Jan 31, 2018 8:24:55 GMT -5
other sports that use it are filled with stoppages anyway, so its no matter if you gotta wait a couple of minutes for a decision. the clock dont stop in football, so depending on how it evolves, we could end up with 15 minute injury times. im also not convinced that it will actually get better/quicker. it all depends on which direction they take it... Yeah, it's Americanzing the sport in the sense that English Football will now be filled with all the stoppages that ruin American Football. And it really won't be long until advertisements get involved with VAR and we'll start having commercial breaks for every VAR decision. Soon there will be timeouts and shite like that. Remember, there's a cohort who have been pressing for both "Sin Bins" as well as an extra 39th game played in the US. All these "improvements" are destroying/will destroy the sport. Also, what the fuck was the point of changing the kick-off rule this season? It worked just fine tapping it to your teammate in the centre-circle. I don't get change for change's sake, either. Fucking hell.I must admit, I never even knew they changed that rule..I just thought it was strange that everyone was kicking off in the same way...what is the new rule?
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Post by sgtpeppr on Jan 31, 2018 8:37:57 GMT -5
Yeah, it's Americanzing the sport in the sense that English Football will now be filled with all the stoppages that ruin American Football. And it really won't be long until advertisements get involved with VAR and we'll start having commercial breaks for every VAR decision. Soon there will be timeouts and shite like that. Remember, there's a cohort who have been pressing for both "Sin Bins" as well as an extra 39th game played in the US. All these "improvements" are destroying/will destroy the sport. Also, what the fuck was the point of changing the kick-off rule this season? It worked just fine tapping it to your teammate in the centre-circle. I don't get change for change's sake, either. Fucking hell.I must admit, I never even knew they changed that rule..I just thought it was strange that everyone was kicking off in the same way...what is the new rule? you can now kick off in any direction... it really makes no difference, just means teams now skip the tap forward and pass it directly back.
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Post by Frank Lee Vulgar on Jan 31, 2018 14:40:47 GMT -5
its sh!te. itll never be fast/smooth enough to integrate well into the game, but even if they manage to speed it all up, there will still be errors, so whats the point? Why wouldn't it get faster and smoother over time? It's brand new technology, with some obvious flaws, of course it will get better. And "there will still be errors", yeah, but about 80-90% fewer errors, and mostly the kind of "too close to call" situations where you wouldn't be sure even after seeing multiple replays. By the way, at least in the Bundesliga most of the really long awkward pauses are in situations where there would be awkward pauses without VAR as well, like when players are shouting at the ref after a penalty call/red card.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Jan 31, 2018 15:04:44 GMT -5
its sh!te. itll never be fast/smooth enough to integrate well into the game, but even if they manage to speed it all up, there will still be errors, so whats the point? Why wouldn't it get faster and smoother over time? It's brand new technology, with some obvious flaws, of course it will get better. And "there will still be errors", yeah, but about 80-90% fewer errors, and mostly the kind of "too close to call" situations where you wouldn't be sure even after seeing multiple replays. By the way, at least in the Bundesliga most of the really long awkward pauses are in situations where there would be awkward pauses without VAR as well, like when players are shouting at the ref after a penalty call/red card. I will say that the pauses do bring some drama and tension. I’ve always liked it on the odd occasion where the ref has to speak to his linesman (e.g last year’s FA Cup Final for Alexis’ goal). But the novelty of that will wear off quickly if it happens in every single game multiple times over!
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Post by playthehitsgetoff on Jan 31, 2018 15:07:08 GMT -5
VAR would have played a blinder in the 86 World Cup..Arg v Eng.
Just sayin.
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