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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2006 1:46:44 GMT -5
Everyone seems to think Oasis is "average". A band that got lucky. I've met quite a few people on other forums who also hate Oasis. As an Oasis fan since I heard them it's hard for me to put myslef in their shoes. Why the hate? Liam and Noel's attitude? Or is Oasis really average?(Now that depends on your opinion. One of the reasons why I hate critics.)
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Post by Toast960 on Mar 6, 2006 2:33:05 GMT -5
In the states a lot of people consider them one hit/one album wonders ("Wonderwall"/"(What's The Story) Morning Glory") because they never had the success here they've had everywhere else in the world and when it became quite clear they wern't going to kiss ass, everyone turned on them. Rolling Stone initially praised "Be Here Now" when it first came out as being a masterpiece more or less but then blasted Oasis and the album. A lot of Americans don't like Liam's opinions on things they hold so near and dear to their hearts and they were the first band to come along in a long time to not care about making it in America and after the initial backlash everything just sort of snowballed and after an album like "Standing On The Shoulders of Giants", a good a majority of rock critics in the states just wrote them off.
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Post by Dominic on Mar 6, 2006 7:34:17 GMT -5
Critics take notions, and they know they do, they have the power to get to the average Music fan, a great example of this is Paul Weller, his solo stuff was done mainly in obscurity, and i believe his record label dropped him, and know all of a sudden the press etc are interested, they lift people up, and drop others, another example is Morriesy last year, for years Morriseys solo stuff took real kickings, but at that point the press choose to get behind him, and said it was his best stuff in years, when manys a morrisey fan who stuck around when then press had thrown him out into the wildnerness wouldnt agree, my last example U2, a band i love, on the last album they hailed it as the best since Achtung Baby, when for anyone who owns All that you Can't Leave Behind and maybe Pop would tell you this is clearly not the case, the press pick and choose, look out for it, maybe next year the press will choose to drop interest in the Kaizers or the Arctics, i wouldnt be surprized if on Oasis new album, the press decide to lift them up again, to a further degree than they did with DBTT
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Post by lyla on Mar 6, 2006 8:07:39 GMT -5
because they expect everyone to be like the beatles and be able to progress sonically. even though very very few bands have doen so well, and so them to expect that out of every band that lasts longer than 5 years is irritating.
the problem for oasis is that they started out so fuckin good (and thats undeniable....i mean most critics who dislike oasis will still acknowledge DM and WTSMG to be great) that its hard to go anywhere from there, isnt it? also, they just arent music industry players. i think they have integrity because they are who they are, but their innate britishness also stops americans and the like 'getting' them on a mainstream level (think liam on trl)
i think its unfair because even U2, a band i really like, i would say have only a couple great albums (joshua tree, achtung baby....someone can contest that if you like but the point is not every album is as good as those two including HTDAAB) and a bunch of pretty good records in between. but oasis those first 2 came in sucession so its like everything else is a let down....when really if you changed the order of teh records to like DM, to BHN, WTSMG, SOTSOG, DBTT, HC (yeah i just picked that relatively randomly) i think they'd be held in higher regard by the press cos wtsmg and dbtt are the returns to form.
i mean they say 'fuck' too much, they get into fights, have funny accents, liam has a funny pose on stage, they say 'mean' things about other people, they dont like sucking up and doign radio interviews and spit on stage at mtv awards...basically the very things that make them refreshing from the usual dull artists who thank God and their mum for supporting them, not saying 'sausages' when accepting awards
a lot of people i've met - apart from just knowing wonderwall know 'arent they like, really up themselves?' cos it isnt about the music for so many people and that irritates the hell out of me. like, i do like oasis for things otehr than music - but the music is the central and defining thing and i think thats how it should be.
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Post by SlideAway on Mar 6, 2006 18:18:48 GMT -5
There are a lot of reasons.
For one thing, keep in mind that attitudes towards Oasis are STILL in backlash mode. Don't forget that back in the mid'90s, critics LOVED Oasis, even in the U.S. (WTS)MG got uniformly excellent reviews in the US - better even than in the UK, where the reviews were somewhat mixed (the attitude there was "pretty good - but no Definitely Maybe").
The problem was the band kind of got swallowed in the hype. Expectations were pretty big even in the U.S. for BHN, which also got good reviews in the U.S. but was overall a commercial flop. And the bad press they got from bustups, cancelled tours, and Liam's antics didn't really endear them to most Americans.
The band themselves also has to take some blame. Oasis would have been MUCH better regarded if they hadn't compared themselves to the Beatles SO MUCH. Not only did it sell Noel's songwriting short, it meant that the band never allowed itself to be judged on its own terms. Instead of being judged as just another rock group, they were judged as a would-be Beatles. And while I think DM and MG are clearly up there as some of the best albums ever, clearly their overall output doesn't approach the level of consistency or creativitiy of the Beatles (not that many artists do).
The band also hurt itself in the US and outside the UK with its releases. It was great that MG came out only a year after DM, but that inadvertedly hurt them in the US. DM barely got any promotion early on until mid-95, and just as soon as it started getting some buzz and attention, the attention moved towards MG. So they came to be only known for that one album. DM is still relatively unknown here.
And the band hurt itself by throwing nearly 2 1/2 albums worth of great songs onto b-sides. It's great to have these as "fans-only" songs, but in all seriousness, had they formed a 3rd or 4th album from these songs, they would have been massive. Even had they just made the b-sides available to the U.S. back in '95 or '96, they'd have a much higher reputation. Instead, nobody outside die-hard fans ever heard any Oasis b-sides on record and by the time The Masterplan was released most people had moved on.
So basically, the band's critical reputation, which had been great, came undone because of over-hype, bad press, and the failure to match The Beatles or too many of the other "greats" in longevity and consistency (although I would agree that they've been a much more consistent band than people give them credit for, as none of the following albums were outright bad and all contained several good songs). Their reputation would have been a lot higher had they not been hyped as "the next Beatles," had they not cancelled tours, and/or had they produced a 3rd album that showed greater musical growth and consistency.
Keep in mind, however, that most group's have a peak period of critical support; For Oasis it was between '94-and'97. For The Beatles, it was between '65 and '67. The Beatles were treated as an oddity by the stuffy music press in their first year, got a bunch of praise for A Hard Day's Night, mixed reviews for Beatles for Sale and Help! and then a lot of critical praise for Rubber Soul, Revolver, and Sgt. Pepper. The Whole Magical Mystery Tour project was panned, and The White Album and Abbey Road got mixed reviews. Let it Be got pretty negative reviews. For the Rolling Stones, it was similar - for them, between '68 and '72 followed by a "comeback" in the early '80s and then a decline.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2006 1:19:15 GMT -5
You all make alot of sense. Thanks. Shame the damn critics don;t understand Oasis like we do. You bring up a good point SlideAway. I too have wondered what would've of happened if Noel saves all of those quality B-sides and released an album. BTW I've noticed that U2 was mentioned a few times. I just started listening to them today. I hated the songs from HTDAAB but War is brilliant!
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Post by dearprudence on Mar 16, 2006 14:10:21 GMT -5
i love Slideaway´s opinion,, completly true
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Post by Clint on Mar 16, 2006 14:51:55 GMT -5
Oasis, from an objective point of view, is nothing spectacular: none of the musicians in the band are excellent, there wasnt much experimentation, the songwriting didnt evolve drastically-- so basically its all up to the sound being your thing.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2006 15:02:58 GMT -5
Oasis, from an objective point of view, is nothing spectacular: none of the musicians in the band are excellent, there wasnt much experimentation, the songwriting didnt evolve drastically-- so basically its all up to the sound being your thing. Another good point, but the press obviously don't care much about the quality of musicians if Arctic Moneys can get a 10/10 from NME(Nothing against the Monkeys though. Fanatastic debut album.) It seems the critics just want to smash Oasis in whatever way they can.
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Post by Poshbird05 on Mar 16, 2006 15:35:32 GMT -5
music is subjective you'll never get everyone to agree on one thing
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Post by giggergrl on Mar 16, 2006 20:26:40 GMT -5
1.) cos critics and many common folk "dont get" Liam...
2.) jealous C*** cos of their hair and shoes and megadom !
3.) noel cant be arsed with the music circus * cough* I mean industry !
4.) cos they have stood in the face of opposition CONSISTENTLY and continue to speak their truths !
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