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Post by halftheworldaway91 on Sept 19, 2023 10:55:38 GMT -5
I was just speaking to Barry who works security at my local Tesco. He told me that Liam never liked Russell Brand and had him sussed years ago.
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Post by matt on Sept 19, 2023 12:02:29 GMT -5
To be brutally honest, I don't think Noel Gallagher is smart or sensitive enough to spot the red flags. You can guarantee he probably just equates it to 'lads being lads'. The likes of him and that fuckwit Jonathan Ross are evidently too easily manipulated to be taken in by him. Would probably still back his predatory mate today, I'm just waiting for the inevitable PR disaster from Noel yet again. That's not brutally honest, it's just disgusting. We're talking full on rape, relationship with a fucking 16 year old and other horrific shit. I don't see how you can think anyone, let alone Noel, would just brush this off as today's world being 'woke' or lads being lads... if that's ever the case, then anyone, even Noel, need to reassess their views on women and humanity. Because you have to be a fucking piece of shit to defend this kind of behaviour, no matter who did it. I don't know why you would see Noel a fucking piece of shit in that way. Is he an old fart who no longer understands the world he lives in? He sure seemed to be going that way earlier in the year, although I had a feeling he was evolving in the right way recently. But being an old fart is very very very very different than defending rape or a relationship with a 16 year old. Really? Because I'm seeing the gutter press and right wing nutjobs on twitter saying just that. And I wouldn't be surprised at all if Noel brings out the cop out argument that 'he hasn't been charged or found guilty of anything'. As ever, it's about him, poor old Russell and not the victims. I recall him defending him over the Andrew Sachs thing, expressing pity for his poor old mate. But no consideration whatsoever for the real victim which was the grand daughter of Sachs. |
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Post by defmaybe00 on Sept 19, 2023 12:07:23 GMT -5
That's not brutally honest, it's just disgusting. We're talking full on rape, relationship with a fucking 16 year old and other horrific shit. I don't see how you can think anyone, let alone Noel, would just brush this off as today's world being 'woke' or lads being lads... if that's ever the case, then anyone, even Noel, need to reassess their views on women and humanity. Because you have to be a fucking piece of shit to defend this kind of behaviour, no matter who did it. I don't know why you would see Noel a fucking piece of shit in that way. Is he an old fart who no longer understands the world he lives in? He sure seemed to be going that way earlier in the year, although I had a feeling he was evolving in the right way recently. But being an old fart is very very very very different than defending rape or a relationship with a 16 year old. Really? Because I'm seeing the gutter press and right wing nutjobs on twitter saying just that. And I wouldn't be surprised at all if Noel brings out the cop out argument that 'he hasn't been charged or found guilty of anything'. As ever, it's about him, poor old Russell and not the victims. I recall him defending him over the Andrew Sachs thing, expressing pity for his poor old mate. But no consideration whatsoever for the real victim which was the grand daughter of Sachs. You're just accusing someone of something he never said on a (very serious) matter he's not been questioned about just because you think you know exactly what his thoughts and beliefs are Can't even see what the right wing nutjobs have got to do with it when Noel distanced himself from Brand just as he went that way? |
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Post by The Chief on Sept 19, 2023 12:19:23 GMT -5
That's not brutally honest, it's just disgusting. We're talking full on rape, relationship with a fucking 16 year old and other horrific shit. I don't see how you can think anyone, let alone Noel, would just brush this off as today's world being 'woke' or lads being lads... if that's ever the case, then anyone, even Noel, need to reassess their views on women and humanity. Because you have to be a fucking piece of shit to defend this kind of behaviour, no matter who did it. I don't know why you would see Noel a fucking piece of shit in that way. Is he an old fart who no longer understands the world he lives in? He sure seemed to be going that way earlier in the year, although I had a feeling he was evolving in the right way recently. But being an old fart is very very very very different than defending rape or a relationship with a 16 year old. Really? Because I'm seeing the gutter press and right wing nutjobs on twitter saying just that. And I wouldn't be surprised at all if Noel brings out the cop out argument that 'he hasn't been charged or found guilty of anything'. As ever, it's about him, poor old Russell and not the victims. I recall him defending him over the Andrew Sachs thing, expressing pity for his poor old mate. But no consideration whatsoever for the real victim which was the grand daughter of Sachs. Yeah but Noel never went down to the level of right wing nutjobs as of now. There are nuances and like I said, being an old fart that uses the word 'woke' because he doesn't understand the world he's living in is not at the same level as defending rape. I've been quite a vocal critic of Noel's in the last year but I'm not ready to presume of how he's going to react or what he's going to say about such a serious subject. |
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Post by matt on Sept 19, 2023 12:28:18 GMT -5
Really? Because I'm seeing the gutter press and right wing nutjobs on twitter saying just that. And I wouldn't be surprised at all if Noel brings out the cop out argument that 'he hasn't been charged or found guilty of anything'. As ever, it's about him, poor old Russell and not the victims. I recall him defending him over the Andrew Sachs thing, expressing pity for his poor old mate. But no consideration whatsoever for the real victim which was the grand daughter of Sachs. You're just accusing someone of something he never said on a (very serious) matter he's not been questioned about just because you think you know exactly what his thoughts and beliefs are Can't even see what the right wing nutjobs have got to do with it when Noel distanced himself from Brand just as he went that way? I'm not accusing Noel of anything, but he's an example of a prevailing thought and attitude that allowed Brand to get away with it, citing the Andrew Sachs scandal as a case in point. And he's primed himself to say something utterly fuckwitted given his recent statements in the press, given how he recently derided how his sons (rich and privileged as they are) aren't able to act like "proper men" anymore and that they are victims in modern society. |
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Post by defmaybe00 on Sept 19, 2023 12:40:53 GMT -5
You're just accusing someone of something he never said on a (very serious) matter he's not been questioned about just because you think you know exactly what his thoughts and beliefs are Can't even see what the right wing nutjobs have got to do with it when Noel distanced himself from Brand just as he went that way? I'm not accusing Noel of anything, but he's an example of a prevailing thought and attitude that allowed Brand to get away with it, citing the Andrew Sachs scandal as a case in point. And he's primed himself to say something utterly fuckwitted given his recent statements in the press, given how he recently derided how his sons (rich and privileged as they are) aren't able to act like "proper men" anymore and that they are victims in modern society. Yes, it was a time when men looked the other way or weren't able to recognise how lines were being crossed and Noel may have been guilty of that, but we're talking rape and sexual assault here As unpleasant as Sachsgate was, even that ain't on the same level, and I wouldn't speculate on what someone thinks of *actual* rape As for Noel's general opinions, he says things I can only classify as utter stupidities (from my pov of course) at times, but hearing him explaining himself I also know he's not referring to "lads being lads" and whatever you may frame as "toxic masculinity", and those are his words not mine Being afraid of how your teenage sons are gonna grow up in this world is perfectly reasonable frankly, no matter how rich they are, putting it all on "wokeness" is stupid and that's where he's being an old man who's lost grasp of the modern world But when we look down at his resume, his reputation is much more laddish than his actual being (or, what is known of it), so I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt on what his thoughts on all this are As I said before, he may be a prick, but for a rockstar, and taking into account he may have had his share of groupies in the 90s and the occasional girl flashing boobs at a gig, he always struck me as quite respectful of the women he came across (the bar is low, I know), and that's coming from some of those women themselves |
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Post by spaneli on Sept 19, 2023 12:53:26 GMT -5
You're just accusing someone of something he never said on a (very serious) matter he's not been questioned about just because you think you know exactly what his thoughts and beliefs are Can't even see what the right wing nutjobs have got to do with it when Noel distanced himself from Brand just as he went that way? I'm not accusing Noel of anything, but he's an example of a prevailing thought and attitude that allowed Brand to get away with it, citing the Andrew Sachs scandal as a case in point. And he's primed himself to say something utterly fuckwitted given his recent statements in the press, given how he recently derided how his sons (rich and privileged as they are) aren't able to act like "proper men" anymore and that they are victims in modern society. It’s not difficult to wait until he says something and then have at it. Just try it out; I promise it’s better than whatever it is you’re doing right now. |
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Post by tiger40 on Sept 19, 2023 13:17:23 GMT -5
I see that some woman who used to be on Loose Women (which I've never watched in my life) has been slammed for defending Brand on social media and quite rightly so. Also, another woman who works on GB News has been slammed for defending him.
As for Noel I would be very surprised actually if he even comments on these allegations against Brand since they're not in touch anymore. If he ever does defend him (which I hope he doesn't) then I'll loose a lot of respect for him.
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Post by carlober on Sept 19, 2023 14:43:00 GMT -5
Russell Brand always seemed a creepy knobhead to me anyway.
These accusations don't surprise me in the slightest.
He's just another shitbag like Marilyn Manson.
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Post by matt on Sept 19, 2023 15:52:16 GMT -5
I'm not accusing Noel of anything, but he's an example of a prevailing thought and attitude that allowed Brand to get away with it, citing the Andrew Sachs scandal as a case in point. And he's primed himself to say something utterly fuckwitted given his recent statements in the press, given how he recently derided how his sons (rich and privileged as they are) aren't able to act like "proper men" anymore and that they are victims in modern society. Yes, it was a time when men looked the other way or weren't able to recognise how lines were being crossed and Noel may have been guilty of that, but we're talking rape and sexual assault here As unpleasant as Sachsgate was, even that ain't on the same level, and I wouldn't speculate on what someone thinks of *actual* rape As for Noel's general opinions, he says things I can only classify as utter stupidities (from my pov of course) at times, but hearing him explaining himself I also know he's not referring to "lads being lads" and whatever you may frame as "toxic masculinity", and those are his words not mine Being afraid of how your teenage sons are gonna grow up in this world is perfectly reasonable frankly, no matter how rich they are, putting it all on "wokeness" is stupid and that's where he's being an old man who's lost grasp of the modern world But when we look down at his resume, his reputation is much more laddish than his actual being (or, what is known of it), so I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt on what his thoughts on all this are As I said before, he may be a prick, but for a rockstar, and taking into account he may have had his share of groupies in the 90s and the occasional girl flashing boobs at a gig, he always struck me as quite respectful of the women he came across (the bar is low, I know), and that's coming from some of those women themselves My problem with him is there is genuine social issues at play in the world and he has dismissed them out of hand. He is rich man who only keeps a circle of celebrity pals and he definitely sounds like it. His narrow viewpoint of the world is not going to be conducive to this thing. I think his friendship with the likes of Brand et.al. and that whole celeb jetset lifestyle is symptomatic of his recent views on everything, in that you cannot possible speak on social issues because you have so far removed yourself from society. I don't expect him to reverse that trend here and I speak of it as a problem with celebrity in general. It's a tight bubble that very rarely offers solutions to the worlds ills, in most cases only props them up but unfortunately we all fall hook line and sinker to their views regardless. |
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Post by defmaybe00 on Sept 19, 2023 16:51:14 GMT -5
Yes, it was a time when men looked the other way or weren't able to recognise how lines were being crossed and Noel may have been guilty of that, but we're talking rape and sexual assault here As unpleasant as Sachsgate was, even that ain't on the same level, and I wouldn't speculate on what someone thinks of *actual* rape As for Noel's general opinions, he says things I can only classify as utter stupidities (from my pov of course) at times, but hearing him explaining himself I also know he's not referring to "lads being lads" and whatever you may frame as "toxic masculinity", and those are his words not mine Being afraid of how your teenage sons are gonna grow up in this world is perfectly reasonable frankly, no matter how rich they are, putting it all on "wokeness" is stupid and that's where he's being an old man who's lost grasp of the modern world But when we look down at his resume, his reputation is much more laddish than his actual being (or, what is known of it), so I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt on what his thoughts on all this are As I said before, he may be a prick, but for a rockstar, and taking into account he may have had his share of groupies in the 90s and the occasional girl flashing boobs at a gig, he always struck me as quite respectful of the women he came across (the bar is low, I know), and that's coming from some of those women themselves My problem with him is there is genuine social issues at play in the world and he has dismissed them out of hand. He is rich man who only keeps a circle of celebrity pals and he definitely sounds like it. His narrow viewpoint of the world is not going to be conducive to this thing. I think his friendship with the likes of Brand et.al. and that whole celeb jetset lifestyle is symptomatic of his recent views on everything, in that you cannot possible speak on social issues because you have so far removed yourself from society. I don't expect him to reverse that trend here and I speak of it as a problem with celebrity in general. It's a tight bubble that very rarely offers solutions to the worlds ills, in most cases only props them up but unfortunately we all fall hook line and sinker to their views regardless. I think you're putting too much weight on celebrities mate, and also not considering that Noel in the end wouldn't be particularly bothered/concerned/aware of certain issues anyway. He's not the type, he's not been educated that way, he was working class and proud (still is proud of course) but wasn't exactly offering social commentary with his music or his stands when he wasn't *this* rich and famous yet. Obviously his current situation has made him more detatched from society, but he's not that influential at all. And while I believe he chats shit on things he has no understanding of from time to time with the same tone and purpose he rants against Adele and Sam Smith's music, I rarely get a real sense of bad intentions and actual resentment from him. And honestly I can take it, I'm not expecting him to be the voice I'm looking for on social issues, I'm hardly looking at celebrities for that, even if some are a bit more wired on and aware than others. But again, this isn't only a social issue, although the patriarchy and mysoginy and protection for powerful men of course are, it's also about morality, or whatever you wanna call it, and the way we act as human beings. Rape should be a social issues in the sense that we should manage as a society to educate men in a way that these things just aren't normalised or justified anymore, and when it happens (cause it always will) it's only just fucking perverts and deranged guys and not just insecure fellas who can't accept no as an answer or who feel powerful attacking a girl with their pack of 5 stupid mates. But until that happen, it's up to us as individual. And as an individual, I may be wrong of course cause I only know his public persona, I get the feeling that as much of a prick as he can be Noel knows where the line is on the matter. |
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Post by His Royal Noelness on Sept 20, 2023 4:34:57 GMT -5
Yes, it was a time when men looked the other way or weren't able to recognise how lines were being crossed and Noel may have been guilty of that, but we're talking rape and sexual assault here As unpleasant as Sachsgate was, even that ain't on the same level, and I wouldn't speculate on what someone thinks of *actual* rape As for Noel's general opinions, he says things I can only classify as utter stupidities (from my pov of course) at times, but hearing him explaining himself I also know he's not referring to "lads being lads" and whatever you may frame as "toxic masculinity", and those are his words not mine Being afraid of how your teenage sons are gonna grow up in this world is perfectly reasonable frankly, no matter how rich they are, putting it all on "wokeness" is stupid and that's where he's being an old man who's lost grasp of the modern world But when we look down at his resume, his reputation is much more laddish than his actual being (or, what is known of it), so I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt on what his thoughts on all this are As I said before, he may be a prick, but for a rockstar, and taking into account he may have had his share of groupies in the 90s and the occasional girl flashing boobs at a gig, he always struck me as quite respectful of the women he came across (the bar is low, I know), and that's coming from some of those women themselves My problem with him is there is genuine social issues at play in the world and he has dismissed them out of hand. He is rich man who only keeps a circle of celebrity pals and he definitely sounds like it. His narrow viewpoint of the world is not going to be conducive to this thing. I think his friendship with the likes of Brand et.al. and that whole celeb jetset lifestyle is symptomatic of his recent views on everything, in that you cannot possible speak on social issues because you have so far removed yourself from society. I don't expect him to reverse that trend here and I speak of it as a problem with celebrity in general. It's a tight bubble that very rarely offers solutions to the worlds ills, in most cases only props them up but unfortunately we all fall hook line and sinker to their views regardless. Matt. You’re tearing yourself apart over something someone you don’t personally know *might* or might not say. I would suggest some fresh air and logging off the internet for awhile. |
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Post by 2nz on Sept 20, 2023 8:16:02 GMT -5
Think it's important to divide up the Sachs stuff- which was just in poor taste, and only became a thing once the Daily Mail reported about it and people started to complain long after the fact, and these allegations, which are vile, documenting years of predatory abuse and as dispatches said- hiding in plain sight.
Noel (and Matt's) advisors will be making sure that they keep them well off the topic- any sniff of a story is going to do them a lot of damage. It's a story on these pods if Noel says he likes bootcut jeans ffs.
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Post by theyknowwhatimean on Sept 20, 2023 12:03:47 GMT -5
Hope the cunt goes to chokey. I like Private Eye’s line on the cover of their latest issue: “TIME TO THROW THE BOOKY-WOOK AT HIM.” |
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Post by The Escapist on Sept 20, 2023 12:48:25 GMT -5
Been a bit of a gut-punch, this one.
I've never hid that I've always liked Russell; of course, he was always a vagina, but like Liam, it felt like he had enough self-awareness of his own twattishness to make it endearing. I loved his old radio shows, and even there I must admit that he sometimes came on too strong with women interviewees to the point where Matt would have to step in and rescue things. Hand on heart, though, I never got the sense he would push it further and do so physically; he seemed a good man at heart, just over-charged, but still someone who ultimately knew where the line was. Obviously, not the case. Those text messages seem clear-cut. It's a shame that some of my favourite hours of Noel at his best on that show will now be tainted, and I truly hope Matt had no knowledge of the whole thing. The main takeaway, though, is don't fucking have sex with women if they're saying no, and wear a fucking condom if they want you to.
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Post by tiger40 on Sept 20, 2023 13:23:22 GMT -5
I wonder if that other moron Jonathan Ross is still mates with Russell Brand and if he is then I hope that he doesn't defend Brand.
I don't think that Noel was ever friends with Ross.
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Post by justaroundmidnight on Sept 20, 2023 14:14:38 GMT -5
Think it's important to divide up the Sachs stuff- which was just in poor taste, and only became a thing once the Daily Mail reported about it and people started to complain long after the fact, and these allegations, which are vile, documenting years of predatory abuse and as dispatches said- hiding in plain sight. Noel (and Matt's) advisors will be making sure that they keep them well off the topic- any sniff of a story is going to do them a lot of damage. It's a story on these pods if Noel says he likes bootcut jeans ffs. What's wrong with bootcut jeans? |
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Post by globe on Sept 20, 2023 16:50:10 GMT -5
That call Russell had with the 15 year old lassie on his Radio 2 show in 2007… jeez when you hear that now in the context of what he was allegedly doing with the 16 year old girl… very uncomfortable listen. Especially when you hear Matt chipping in. Don’t get me wrong- I’ve no doubt Matt was simply caught up in the moment and going along with Russell’s “edgy” and “controversial” comedy (at least I hope he was), but looking at it from a new perspective is really, as I say, uncomfortable.
The Sachs call - at the time I thought that was just the pair of them (Brand and Ross) again being high on controversy and taking the piss but looking back now… weird.
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Post by matt on Sept 20, 2023 16:56:49 GMT -5
My problem with him is there is genuine social issues at play in the world and he has dismissed them out of hand. He is rich man who only keeps a circle of celebrity pals and he definitely sounds like it. His narrow viewpoint of the world is not going to be conducive to this thing. I think his friendship with the likes of Brand et.al. and that whole celeb jetset lifestyle is symptomatic of his recent views on everything, in that you cannot possible speak on social issues because you have so far removed yourself from society. I don't expect him to reverse that trend here and I speak of it as a problem with celebrity in general. It's a tight bubble that very rarely offers solutions to the worlds ills, in most cases only props them up but unfortunately we all fall hook line and sinker to their views regardless. I think you're putting too much weight on celebrities mate, and also not considering that Noel in the end wouldn't be particularly bothered/concerned/aware of certain issues anyway. He's not the type, he's not been educated that way, he was working class and proud (still is proud of course) but wasn't exactly offering social commentary with his music or his stands when he wasn't *this* rich and famous yet. Obviously his current situation has made him more detatched from society, but he's not that influential at all. And while I believe he chats shit on things he has no understanding of from time to time with the same tone and purpose he rants against Adele and Sam Smith's music, I rarely get a real sense of bad intentions and actual resentment from him. And honestly I can take it, I'm not expecting him to be the voice I'm looking for on social issues, I'm hardly looking at celebrities for that, even if some are a bit more wired on and aware than others. But again, this isn't only a social issue, although the patriarchy and mysoginy and protection for powerful men of course are, it's also about morality, or whatever you wanna call it, and the way we act as human beings. Rape should be a social issues in the sense that we should manage as a society to educate men in a way that these things just aren't normalised or justified anymore, and when it happens (cause it always will) it's only just fucking perverts and deranged guys and not just insecure fellas who can't accept no as an answer or who feel powerful attacking a girl with their pack of 5 stupid mates. But until that happen, it's up to us as individual. And as an individual, I may be wrong of course cause I only know his public persona, I get the feeling that as much of a prick as he can be Noel knows where the line is on the matter.I accept that, and I accept the reasoning he would know where the line is with this matter. What I'm trying to say is that as somebody who seemingly has an opinion on most things in society, I don't think he's entitled to express that given he has voluntarily taken himself out of it. And when you misjudge your friends on the level of having somebody like Brand as your best man, then he just further devalues himself and his own opinions. |
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Post by defmaybe00 on Sept 20, 2023 17:28:04 GMT -5
That call Russell had with the 15 year old lassie on his Radio 2 show in 2007… jeez when you hear that now in the context of what he was allegedly doing with the 16 year old girl… very uncomfortable listen. Especially when you hear Matt chipping in. Don’t get me wrong- I’ve no doubt Matt was simply caught up in the moment and going along with Russell’s “edgy” and “controversial” comedy (at least I hope he was), but looking at it from a new perspective is really, as I say, uncomfortable. The Sachs call - at the time I thought that was just the pair of them (Brand and Ross) again being high on controversy and taking the piss but looking back now… weird. The thing with Matt is I genuinely get the feeling he realises not all of it aged particularly well and they didn't always cover themselves in glory I never completely got that sense of self-awareness from Russ, even tho he seemingly turned his life around, and that was before the allegations came out |
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Post by aesthetic on Sept 21, 2023 3:26:21 GMT -5
I don't think he's entitled to express that given he has voluntarily taken himself out of it. But he isn't, he hasn't. As somebody else pointed out, you are getting worked up about something that hasn't happened. Life is too short. Enjoy yourself, it's later than you think. |
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Goosey
Oasis Roadie
Posts: 184
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Post by Goosey on Sept 21, 2023 8:59:19 GMT -5
I think you're putting too much weight on celebrities mate, and also not considering that Noel in the end wouldn't be particularly bothered/concerned/aware of certain issues anyway. He's not the type, he's not been educated that way, he was working class and proud (still is proud of course) but wasn't exactly offering social commentary with his music or his stands when he wasn't *this* rich and famous yet. Obviously his current situation has made him more detatched from society, but he's not that influential at all. And while I believe he chats shit on things he has no understanding of from time to time with the same tone and purpose he rants against Adele and Sam Smith's music, I rarely get a real sense of bad intentions and actual resentment from him. And honestly I can take it, I'm not expecting him to be the voice I'm looking for on social issues, I'm hardly looking at celebrities for that, even if some are a bit more wired on and aware than others. But again, this isn't only a social issue, although the patriarchy and mysoginy and protection for powerful men of course are, it's also about morality, or whatever you wanna call it, and the way we act as human beings. Rape should be a social issues in the sense that we should manage as a society to educate men in a way that these things just aren't normalised or justified anymore, and when it happens (cause it always will) it's only just fucking perverts and deranged guys and not just insecure fellas who can't accept no as an answer or who feel powerful attacking a girl with their pack of 5 stupid mates. But until that happen, it's up to us as individual. And as an individual, I may be wrong of course cause I only know his public persona, I get the feeling that as much of a prick as he can be Noel knows where the line is on the matter.I accept that, and I accept the reasoning he would know where the line is with this matter. What I'm trying to say is that as somebody who seemingly has an opinion on most things in society, I don't think he's entitled to express that given he has voluntarily taken himself out of it. And when you misjudge your friends on the level of having somebody like Brand as your best man, then he just further devalues himself and his own opinions. You’re coming across as slightly deranged here. |
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Goosey
Oasis Roadie
Posts: 184
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Post by Goosey on Sept 21, 2023 9:40:57 GMT -5
The AKA What a Life! Music video is very problematic now
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Post by Mario on Sept 21, 2023 10:15:49 GMT -5
I subscribed to Matt Morgan on Patreon and I'm catching up on the May-Sep podcasts with Noel. Really enjoyable to hear from Noel!
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Post by matt on Sept 21, 2023 11:13:33 GMT -5
I accept that, and I accept the reasoning he would know where the line is with this matter. What I'm trying to say is that as somebody who seemingly has an opinion on most things in society, I don't think he's entitled to express that given he has voluntarily taken himself out of it. And when you misjudge your friends on the level of having somebody like Brand as your best man, then he just further devalues himself and his own opinions. You’re coming across as slightly deranged here. Whatever. I don't think celebs have any valid opinions on society, Noel especially, and I'll keep that opinion. |
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Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5