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Post by Lennon2217 on Apr 17, 2013 22:24:31 GMT -5
The Roller does suck in a bad way...... '..call me the roller....uh, un....' even cowbell wouldn't save that song. God bless. The lyrics might not be great but it's a catchy tune and that's what really matters. Sure lyrics matter but I'm not that serious about it. If I was I'd much rather read a book than listen to a song. Shine on Bruno, Like the moon and the stars and the sun!  |
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Post by Willie T. Soke on Apr 17, 2013 22:30:05 GMT -5
The Roller does suck in a bad way...... '..call me the roller....uh, un....' even cowbell wouldn't save that song. God bless. The lyrics might not be great but it's a catchy tune and that's what really matters. Sure lyrics matter but I'm not that serious about it. If I was I'd much rather read a book than listen to a song. i'm not hung up on lyrics either..... i mean, I remember reading the linear notes to Radiohead's OK Computer album well after the fact and realizing the lyrics actually make sense on the songs that are hard to understand..... '.....they call me the rollaaaa, uh un. i'll squeeze and unfold ya....' i'm gonna have nightmares tonight now....  God bless. |
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Post by Willie T. Soke on Apr 17, 2013 22:32:54 GMT -5
Agree that a producer is hard pressed to save a rock and roll song that doesn't bring it...but for historical accuracy, penny lane and strawberry fields were released as a single BEFORE Sgt peppers as in those days bands didn't want to rip off their fans by including the single in the album...crazy days...imagine Sgt Pepper with those two on it George Martin IMO, is not a good example to back up the point that some people are trying to make in this thread (ie: that the producer is secondary to the songs which need to stand on their own merits). George is inextricably linked to The Beatles and he is rightly, always mentioned as part of the alchemy that created their legend. Sgt. Pepper is a masterwork of production and Martin is very much responsible for its success. This record was The Beatles' response to their frustrations about the limitations of playing live; as early as Nowhere Man, they were having trouble replicating the studio produced harmonies live. Pepper is ALL about production and deliberately unable to be replicated live (at least at that time in 67). It was such a game changer; widely regarded as a masterwork for ringing in psychedelia with full force. Personally, I don't think it's their best record. Tracks like Lovely Rita and Fixing a Hole are pretty ordinary (Paul at his most twee) but the production certainly lifts them (all that multi-tracking with the harmonies). A Day in The Life and Lucy are of course masterful but deft production still plays a big part in their impact. Noel was obviously listening to Mr Kite when he wrote TIOBI... What Martin and his engineers managed (staggeringly on four and finally eight track machines) was astounding. The Beatles, great songwriters for the most part, were not virtuosos with their instruments or in the studio (Andy and Gem seem the opposite).The Beatles would always go to Martin with their ideas and ask what he could do to fully realise them. As such, I always regard Martin as almost a band member of The Beatles, more so than with the producers for many of the Fab Four's contemporaries. When I listen to any Stones record for instance, I don't for a minute think about or even know who the producer was, largely because they're a band rooted in the Blues and known probably more so for their live chops than their studio output. Owen Morris doesn't pop into my mind much when listening to 'his' Oasis records (which are fairly basic- very loud guitars turned up to 11 and put through that mythical 'box'). I only think of him on the rare occasion I give Be Here Now a spin (wishing he'd stayed off the gear!  With BE, the album must first be a decent collection of tunes, no matter how much Sitek's production has or has not impacted. Performing the songs competently live will then be the ultimate litmus test- FOTF without the brass for example, will be an interesting listen... i have the Newman's Salad dressing for you.... fuck yeah! |
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Post by jakob61907 on Apr 18, 2013 0:36:09 GMT -5
Andy Bell fighting back to Lilleywhites comments!
Andy Bell @andybebop 5m
@sillywhite Didn't stop you taking the job. How did that X factor audition work out for you Steve? What a pro haha!!
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J-200
Oasis Roadie
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Post by J-200 on Apr 18, 2013 2:02:08 GMT -5
There's no denying they're not great songwriters (although between them 3, they can come up with decent records), but to produce a record with someone then say they're shit when you are shit yourself isn't saying much about the guy. I guess DGSS sessions didnt go well but they didnt talk about that. The main thing is here, is, who picked that shit producer in the first place. that was a really dumb idea I don't think so, man. Liam's gotten better and his best penned songs were left off of Dig out your soul. Andy's written some pure gold in Ride (One has to wonder what the fuck is keeping him from doing so now.....most likely Noel syndrome) and Gem has great songs under his belt just most of them seemed to be in Heathen Chemistry's case were executed in the wrong way and composed wrong. Besides let's not forget as good as Noel was at the helm of Oasis he made some massive mistakes when it came to the direction of the bands musicianship. Fuck him for "Giants" and "DOYS" god dam that brilliant man to hell! Liam and Gem wrote some good songs but I don't think they are great songwriter. and Andy is... yeah, I agree with you about him. "Andy's written some pure gold in Ride (One has to wonder what the fuck is keeping him from doing so now.)" |
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J-200
Oasis Roadie
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Post by J-200 on Apr 18, 2013 2:06:23 GMT -5
Andy Bell fighting back to Lilleywhites comments! Andy Bell @andybebop 5m @sillywhite Didn't stop you taking the job. How did that X factor audition work out for you Steve? What a pro haha!!  But overall, I don't think Lilleywhite rips on them that much. It seems Lilleywhite really likes FOTF. |
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Post by thestellasarecold on Apr 18, 2013 2:09:08 GMT -5
George Martin IMO, is not a good example to back up the point that some people are trying to make in this thread (ie: that the producer is secondary to the songs which need to stand on their own merits). George is inextricably linked to The Beatles and he is rightly, always mentioned as part of the alchemy that created their legend. Sgt. Pepper is a masterwork of production and Martin is very much responsible for its success. This record was The Beatles' response to their frustrations about the limitations of playing live; as early as Nowhere Man, they were having trouble replicating the studio produced harmonies live. Pepper is ALL about production and deliberately unable to be replicated live (at least at that time in 67). It was such a game changer; widely regarded as a masterwork for ringing in psychedelia with full force. Personally, I don't think it's their best record. Tracks like Lovely Rita and Fixing a Hole are pretty ordinary (Paul at his most twee) but the production certainly lifts them (all that multi-tracking with the harmonies). A Day in The Life and Lucy are of course masterful but deft production still plays a big part in their impact. Noel was obviously listening to Mr Kite when he wrote TIOBI... What Martin and his engineers managed (staggeringly on four and finally eight track machines) was astounding. The Beatles, great songwriters for the most part, were not virtuosos with their instruments or in the studio (Andy and Gem seem the opposite).The Beatles would always go to Martin with their ideas and ask what he could do to fully realise them. As such, I always regard Martin as almost a band member of The Beatles, more so than with the producers for many of the Fab Four's contemporaries. When I listen to any Stones record for instance, I don't for a minute think about or even know who the producer was, largely because they're a band rooted in the Blues and known probably more so for their live chops than their studio output. Owen Morris doesn't pop into my mind much when listening to 'his' Oasis records (which are fairly basic- very loud guitars turned up to 11 and put through that mythical 'box'). I only think of him on the rare occasion I give Be Here Now a spin (wishing he'd stayed off the gear! With BE, the album must first be a decent collection of tunes, no matter how much Sitek's production has or has not impacted. Performing the songs competently live will then be the ultimate litmus test- FOTF without the brass for example, will be an interesting listen... i have the Newman's Salad dressing for you.... fuck yeah! Newman's the man SF! Nobody owns Newman's Own! |
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Post by thestellasarecold on Apr 18, 2013 2:22:48 GMT -5
Andy Bell fighting back to Lilleywhites comments! Andy Bell @andybebop 5m @sillywhite Didn't stop you taking the job. How did that X factor audition work out for you Steve? What a pro haha!! But overall, I don't think Lilleywhite rips on them that much. It seems Lilleywhite really likes FOTF. Steve's tweet was hardly vitriolic, nor were BE's original comments if I remember correctly (Liam is usually far more colourful).Lilleywhite is defending his position with a slight dig. In technical terms, DGSS sounds perfectly 'nice and shiny' to my simpleton ears. Seriously, not even Phil Spector could've done much with Standing on the Edge of the Noise. He'd most likely have drawn his pistol and fired in LAG's general direction. |
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redlandsman87
Oasis Roadie
Because something is happening here, But you don't know what it is...Do you, Mister Jones ?
Posts: 321
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Post by redlandsman87 on Apr 18, 2013 3:00:51 GMT -5
I'll put it this way. Lillywhite ruined the La's only record and he tried pulling ALL of the same tricks on DGSS. Songs like For Anyone and The Morning Son REEK of There She Goes and Looking Glass. The songs on the La's record ARE there, but he still managed to muck it all to hell.
The aforementioned songs are all either brilliantly simple or complex pieces of songwriting, for their own merits. But whereas The La's abandoned their own record due to being unsatisfied by his shoddy production skills, seeing as he was left to "Frankenstein" The La's record together (really doing a horrible job...volume for one, clarity for two, respect for the band being the final straw) I'm glad he left DGSS early so the band could finish the product. He should have dipped out and let Lee Mavers finish his own record as he let BE.
It doesn't matter how many "A-List" stars you have on your production record. You fuck up a band like The La's? Fuck up Beady Eye? Really...how "amazing" of a producer can the guy be? He neither challenges nor engages bands. He just does what he has to to earn a paycheck.
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Post by andymorris on Apr 18, 2013 3:13:38 GMT -5
wow what a douche, his producing resume was already bad, but this is, this is... wow Do you even know who this man is? He's been involved with far more classic records than flavor of the month Dave Sitek. Yeah i do, cant say i like any of the records he produced, IN 30 YEARS As for Sitek, i'm not a fan of his work either |
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Post by Bruno on Apr 18, 2013 3:32:23 GMT -5
Andy Bell fighting back to Lilleywhites comments! Andy Bell @andybebop 5m @sillywhite Didn't stop you taking the job. How did that X factor audition work out for you Steve? What a pro haha!! Andy's the man!!! fuck yeah!! |
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Post by thetruth on Apr 18, 2013 3:52:19 GMT -5
I'll put it this way. Lillywhite ruined the La's only record and he tried pulling ALL of the same tricks on DGSS. Songs like For Anyone and The Morning Son REEK of There She Goes and Looking Glass. The songs on the La's record ARE there, but he still managed to muck it all to hell. The aforementioned songs are all either brilliantly simple or complex pieces of songwriting, for their own merits. But whereas The La's abandoned their own record due to being unsatisfied by his shoddy production skills, seeing as he was left to "Frankenstein" The La's record together (really doing a horrible job...volume for one, clarity for two, respect for the band being the final straw) I'm glad he left DGSS early so the band could finish the product. He should have dipped out and let Lee Mavers finish his own record as he let BE. It doesn't matter how many "A-List" stars you have on your production record. You fuck up a band like The La's? Fuck up Beady Eye? Really...how "amazing" of a producer can the guy be? He neither challenges nor engages bands. He just does what he has to to earn a paycheck. To be faire Lee Mavers is a crazy lad, he's still reworking the same songs 20 years after, still unsastified and hasn't written a new one since that time. Liam and the lads on the other are normal people, serious but who need direction. The way FOTF sound is amazing, the producer has given them a real personnal sound, he made them forget about Lennon and the 60's (I hope), and made them sound loud, like Liam's voice is supposed too, and hadn't really since BHN. I have no idea how BE is gonna be but at least I'm sure it'll fit BDI, it'll be their sound, a sound that fit them. I know every track is going to sound the best they could have. That's a real producer job with idea. When I listen to DGSS, ok the song are flat, but come on there is some good songs on it and most of them sound like a 60's cover band because of the production, the effect on Liam's voice are atrocious, the echos... And then he said he had faith in a voice ? He didn't even manage to make the voice sound great. Siteck manages to make Liam's voice sound amazing with almost doing nothing on it. |
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Post by Willie T. Soke on Apr 18, 2013 4:09:27 GMT -5
i have the Newman's Salad dressing for you.... fuck yeah! Newman's the man SF! Nobody owns Newman's Own! fuck yeah! God bless. |
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Post by Willie T. Soke on Apr 18, 2013 4:14:01 GMT -5
I'll put it this way. Lillywhite ruined the La's only record and he tried pulling ALL of the same tricks on DGSS. Songs like For Anyone and The Morning Son REEK of There She Goes and Looking Glass. The songs on the La's record ARE there, but he still managed to muck it all to hell. The aforementioned songs are all either brilliantly simple or complex pieces of songwriting, for their own merits. But whereas The La's abandoned their own record due to being unsatisfied by his shoddy production skills, seeing as he was left to "Frankenstein" The La's record together (really doing a horrible job...volume for one, clarity for two, respect for the band being the final straw) I'm glad he left DGSS early so the band could finish the product. He should have dipped out and let Lee Mavers finish his own record as he let BE. It doesn't matter how many "A-List" stars you have on your production record. You fuck up a band like The La's? Fuck up Beady Eye? Really...how "amazing" of a producer can the guy be? He neither challenges nor engages bands. He just does what he has to to earn a paycheck. that one La's record is fucking amazing, though....... better than anything from the Pixies, Pavement or Nirvana. fuck yeah! |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2013 5:50:39 GMT -5
Lillywhite hardly ruined that album, it's a top top record.
Who's to say it would have sounded better if Mavers had 100% control? Probably still wouldn't be released today!
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Post by freddy838 on Apr 18, 2013 6:38:48 GMT -5
To my ears DGSS sounds alright. I have no issues with it sounding like a 60s record or whatever, if that's what they wanted to achieve then they achieved it quite well. I was pleasantly surprised with the quality, having had pretty low expectations. I have a bigger issue with Dave Sardy's production on Noel's album, it some places it makes me feel a bit ill listening to how the songs got ruined. Ultimately what I would like is a Ride album with Liam belting out the vocals with someone like Sitek adding something new on top. I hope we get something a bit like it with BE.
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Post by metaltiger on Apr 18, 2013 6:47:08 GMT -5
Steve Lillywhite replied to Andy with some more vitriol:
Steve Lillywhite CBE @sillywhite 32m
@andybebop Lies have been said Andy... but I don't blame the puppets...
The puppets? Damn, I think he's referring to Andy, Gem, and Chris. This is getting heated up.
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Post by Bruno on Apr 18, 2013 6:48:17 GMT -5
Well Lillywhite just tweeted again....
Sounds like he might have not been too pleased with Andy's response on twitter.
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Post by metaltiger on Apr 18, 2013 6:56:54 GMT -5
There's more. Steve Lillywhite CBE @sillywhite 33m you lie monobrow, you lie....... Kevin Mathews @kevinmmathews11 27m @sillywhite which one? dumb or dumber? Steve Lillywhite CBE @sillywhite 25m @kevinmmathews11 Dumber of course !!  |
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Post by metaltiger on Apr 18, 2013 6:57:18 GMT -5
He's out on a mission now.
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Post by Willie T. Soke on Apr 18, 2013 7:02:35 GMT -5
they really need to mud wrestle in Pretty Green bikinis....
fuck yeah!
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Post by LlAM on Apr 18, 2013 7:05:51 GMT -5
This is getting embarrassing.
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Post by jakob61907 on Apr 18, 2013 7:17:26 GMT -5
Cannot wait for Liams response. He'll tear him to bits. Don't mess with a Gallagher with a war of words
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Post by Nyron Nosworthy on Apr 18, 2013 7:20:26 GMT -5
Anyone got a link to the Lillywhite leaving story? Not doubting it, just missed it
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Post by Bruno on Apr 18, 2013 7:22:47 GMT -5
Anyone got a link to the Lillywhite leaving story? Not doubting it, just missed it Seconded, I'd like to read that too. |
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Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5